Balancing Financial security and Bitcoin Accumulation

[Derekfunds]

but then again It is not just about having a stable source of income but it is also about willingness to invest because some folks have the money but the willingness is not there.

And also being in control of your finances. Even when someone is fired up with the zeal to invest, and even when he eventually starts investing, if he's not able to stay in control of his finances, he'll always keep fucking up his investment.
I'm not saying one must master the act of controlling their finances before they can get started, I'm simply saying that it is a necessity, something you need to master before you can reach your long term goals.

I'll vividly add to this, it's always better to invest in what you understand the basic knowledge about, you don't just jump into investing in what it seems to be generating income when you are not fully equipped with the right knowledge, not only knowledge but you must start from scratch how that business works, what makes it works, if it doesn't seem to be working, what next to do, who to meet, putting in more money, or changing location as well as environment, bringing to the product to those that actually needs them.

All these are the actual beginners challenges you must have known firstly before thinking of investment into a particular product. It doesn't actually needs money from the start but the full know how matters most before money is put into it

Well I'm beginning to think that there is more you are talking about comparing to Bitcoin investment, I don't really think you require all of this details that you've emphasized to start investing in Bitcoin, it's very simple that you know about Bitcoin already and you you have a discretionary funds to invest with, Well I must say that Bitcoin investment doesn't require you a change of environment, because it doesn't have nothing to do with environment, you can invest and accumulate Bitcoin anywhere you find yourself. Sometimes mistakes can not be avoided because we are human and are prone to making mistakes, and we can find it difficult to make mistakes, but what is most important is moving ahead of that mistakes and find a lasting solution or strategy to accumulate more consistently and continue to hodl.

I think you are misunderstanding Odogwu Blockchain, if you read the post well you will see that the investment Odogwu is talking about is not really Bitcoin rather he was talking about something outside Bitcoin which I consider to be off, of what this discussion is all about even though he is correct in what he is saying. But Odogwu last words is what I don't buy because there is no investment that doesn't require money for a start even though it is very small... one must use money to start it up but what doesn't really matter is how much you start up with but whatsoever one is starting up with, one have to be consistent and should have a good management skill.

[Ever-young]

Me I no support the idea of using all 30% for accumulating Bitcoin. Don't put yourself in a bad spot because you want to prioritize accumulating Bitcoin. Use a smaller percentage that won't make you run out of cash or get to use your emergency funds for things that aren't emergency. Plan your finances properly and allocate your funds very well. No do pass yourself. Say your friends they invest 100k monthly no go make you to dey do the same. If na 10k you fit afford and you no go broker, they run am like that and soonest you go done accumulate some decent amount of Bitcoin.

I totally agree.There's no definite percentage for saving like the one OP came up with called the "50/30/20." The amount a person earns and his responsibilities are intertwined, and it is what influences his savings. Some persons have bills upon bills on their heads, while others do not or have less. These are important factors that should be taken into consideration when setting aside funds for savings or Bitcoin investments. No one should kill himself because of a formula, the most important thing is to try and save, no matter how small.

You're right, everyone or should I say every investor has their own unique financial conditions as well as goals, and these are the things that influences whatever decisions the investor chooses to make or whatever strategy the investor chooses to employ during his accumulation period. We cannot say that the OP's strategy is wrong, because the truth is that, there are actually investors who can adopt that strategy and it'll work perfectly for them as their financial situations and investment goals completely aligns with that strategy. That's why it's always important for every investor to identify their own unique situations in order to be able to choose a much better strategy to help them achieve their long term goals.

[I_Anime]

but then again It is not just about having a stable source of income but it is also about willingness to invest because some folks have the money but the willingness is not there.

And also being in control of your finances. Even when someone is fired up with the zeal to invest, and even when he eventually starts investing, if he's not able to stay in control of his finances, he'll always keep fucking up his investment.
I'm not saying one must master the act of controlling their finances before they can get started, I'm simply saying that it is a necessity, something you need to master before you can reach your long term goals.

I'll vividly add to this, it's always better to invest in what you understand the basic knowledge about, you don't just jump into investing in what it seems to be generating income when you are not fully equipped with the right knowledge, not only knowledge but you must start from scratch how that business works, what makes it works, if it doesn't seem to be working, what next to do, who to meet, putting in more money, or changing location as well as environment, bringing to the product to those that actually needs them.

All these are the actual beginners challenges you must have known firstly before thinking of investment into a particular product. It doesn't actually needs money from the start but the full know how matters most before money is put into it

First Bitcoin investment is not a business is an investment and is usually for long-term, if you take Bitcoin accumulation as your business then you are no longer investing rather you are trading it , and before you can think of taken profit or depending on your Bitcoin stash is when you have gotten enough stash ( having a good amount of Bitcoin in your secure wallet ) .

In Bitcoin investment going for complex knowledge is not necessary to start , you just need just the simple basic knowledge then you are good to go , just know how to execute proper planning and know how to manage resources. Maybe when you have started accumulating Bitcoin then you can start going further to gain more knowledge that will help you manage your Bitcoin investment properly and Same time understand the purpose of Bitcoin as a digital currency too.

Sure.  There could be some kindf of a formula for dividing out how to build out back up funds (such as emergency funds and/or reserve funds), yet I really doubt that the combination of the back up funds needs to be built faster than your investment into bitcoin..yet sure, guys can make those kinds of choices, but it seems strange to me to be overly waiting with investing into back up funds, when the back up funds are primarily meant to back up your bitcoin investment, but if you don't have shit for a bitcoin investment because you are stocking away a bunch of back up funds, then to me that does not necessarily come off as balanced.. though sure guys can come to their own conclusions (determinations) in regards to their level of aggressiveness when it comes to their bitcoin investment

I fully understand what you are trying to say , well is normal to prior our emergency funds because it usually play a vital role when investing in Bitcoin cause it will reduce the chances of us depending on our Bitcoin to handle expenses, which same time increase the rate of our Bitcoin accumulation growth . Yes you are right I think we should focus more on building our investment than back up funds (reserve funds ) because the whole purpose is to back up our investment to keep the aggressiveness going without over doing it .

[Joy- maker]

First Bitcoin investment is not a business is an investment and is usually for long-term, if you take Bitcoin accumulation as your business then you are no longer investing rather you are trading it , and before you can think of taken profit or depending on your Bitcoin stash is when you have gotten enough stash ( having a good amount of Bitcoin in your secure wallet ) .

The truth is bitcoin is not supposed to taking as business, rather bitcoin should be taking as investment for long term, why because  there is a very big difference between investing and business, investing is more of allocating funds or resources to assets which as bitcoin, stocks bonds, real estate and so on, while business is more of buying, selling and exchanging goods and services. So if you check it well business is more of trading, while investing more of allocating funds to assets, so people should stop seeing bitcoin as  business and start seeing it as investment.

In Bitcoin investment going for complex knowledge is not necessary to start , you just need just the simple basic knowledge then you are good to go , just know how to execute proper planning and know how to manage resources. Maybe when you have started accumulating Bitcoin then you can start going further to gain more knowledge that will help you manage your Bitcoin investment properly and Same time understand the purpose of Bitcoin as a digital currency too.

you are correct you don't need complex knowledge to get started with bitcoin, with basic knowledge about bitcoin you are good to go. Just know how to sign up in an exchange, know how to buy bitcoin and know how to store and security your bitcoin's, you are good to go with bitcoin. Then from there you can learn learning and gaining more knowledge about bitcoin, because waiting to learn and gain complex knowledge about bitcoin can delay your investment journey so get started and learn inside the system and not outside the system.

[Zackz5000]

When it’s about stating hypothesis, everything goes and what I really think is that, it doesn’t matter how one earns or how small the amount might be. Someone who is really concerned about growth wouldn’t want to live day to day. There isn’t a way to grow without having some kind of savings or investments which makes it paramount that, people should always find ways to cut down for investment purposes it’s a sacrifice to safe guard your future.

The mistake lots of investor made in the past and I think lots of potential future investors are in that category, is waiting to get rich or richer before investing in Bitcoin, I think it should be constantly being talked about in our societies that Bitcoin investment is not for the rich, their are lots of people who see a potential and need to invest but I waiting to get richer without knowing that the price of Bitcoin is not a barrier for the poor or average person, it's an investment opportunity so it's put cash into it periodically according to the person income and watch it grow for years, well ignorance they say is disease.

You are right with your point actually what we don't know is bigger than us at first i use to think the same that bitcoin is very expensive not know that one can actually buy bitcoin fraction by fraction we don't necessarily need to rich before we can start accumulating Bitcoin as bitcoin investment is for both the rich and poor, many people has the zeal to invest but the thought of thinking that bitcoin is too expensive has been a barrier to them, waiting to get rich is never solution when the can start accumulating using the DCA strategy to gradually accumulate either every weeks or months.

[Jostern]

When it’s about stating hypothesis, everything goes and what I really think is that, it doesn’t matter how one earns or how small the amount might be. Someone who is really concerned about growth wouldn’t want to live day to day. There isn’t a way to grow without having some kind of savings or investments which makes it paramount that, people should always find ways to cut down for investment purposes it’s a sacrifice to safe guard your future.

The mistake lots of investor made in the past and I think lots of potential future investors are in that category, is waiting to get rich or richer before investing in Bitcoin, I think it should be constantly being talked about in our societies that Bitcoin investment is not for the rich, their are lots of people who see a potential and need to invest but I waiting to get richer without knowing that the price of Bitcoin is not a barrier for the poor or average person, it's an investment opportunity so it's put cash into it periodically according to the person income and watch it grow for years, well ignorance they say is disease.

You are right with your point actually what we don't know is bigger than us at first i use to think the same that bitcoin is very expensive not know that one can actually buy bitcoin fraction by fraction we don't necessarily need to rich before we can start accumulating Bitcoin as bitcoin investment is for both the rich and poor, many people has the zeal to invest but the thought of thinking that bitcoin is too expensive has been a barrier to them, waiting to get rich is never solution when the can start accumulating using the DCA strategy to gradually accumulate either every weeks or months.

You are absolutely right, at some point when I don’t know much about Bitcoin I used to think that I need a lot of money or stable source of income to invest in Bitcoin, not knowing that I can actually accumulate Bitcoin little by little using the DCA method, you don’t even have to been wealthy to be able to accumulate Bitcoin all what is just required is to have a discretionary funds to invest with boom you’re good to go it doesn’t have to be on a daily basis, depending on when you’ve a discretionary funds to continue accumulating bitcoin gradually and to hodl for a longer term period.

[GIF-JOBS]

When it’s about stating hypothesis, everything goes and what I really think is that, it doesn’t matter how one earns or how small the amount might be. Someone who is really concerned about growth wouldn’t want to live day to day. There isn’t a way to grow without having some kind of savings or investments which makes it paramount that, people should always find ways to cut down for investment purposes it’s a sacrifice to safe guard your future.

The mistake lots of investor made in the past and I think lots of potential future investors are in that category, is waiting to get rich or richer before investing in Bitcoin, I think it should be constantly being talked about in our societies that Bitcoin investment is not for the rich, their are lots of people who see a potential and need to invest but I waiting to get richer without knowing that the price of Bitcoin is not a barrier for the poor or average person, it's an investment opportunity so it's put cash into it periodically according to the person income and watch it grow for years, well ignorance they say is disease.

You are right with your point actually what we don't know is bigger than us at first i use to think the same that bitcoin is very expensive not know that one can actually buy bitcoin fraction by fraction we don't necessarily need to rich before we can start accumulating Bitcoin as bitcoin investment is for both the rich and poor, many people has the zeal to invest but the thought of thinking that bitcoin is too expensive has been a barrier to them, waiting to get rich is never solution when the can start accumulating using the DCA strategy to gradually accumulate either every weeks or months.

You are absolutely right, at some point when I don’t know much about Bitcoin I used to think that I need a lot of money or stable source of income to invest in Bitcoin, not knowing that I can actually accumulate Bitcoin little by little using the DCA method, you don’t even have to been wealthy to be able to accumulate Bitcoin all what is just required is to have a discretionary funds to invest with boom you’re good to go it doesn’t have to be on a daily basis, depending on when you’ve a discretionary funds to continue accumulating bitcoin gradually and to hodl for a longer term period.

In Bitcoin investment, the amount of your income does not matter, whatever your income is, if everything can run smoothly through proper financial management, then DCA is definitely possible even with a very small amount of money, in the case of DCA, no matter how much money you invest, it does not matter, in DCA you only need to buy consistently and hold it for the long term, whether you are rich or not, whether you have large capital or small, create a stable source of income and start DCA, hold it for the long term without worrying about short-term gains, because through this your wealth will continue to grow over time, as a result, it will bring a huge profit after a long time.

[Olatundespo]

When it’s about stating hypothesis, everything goes and what I really think is that, it doesn’t matter how one earns or how small the amount might be. Someone who is really concerned about growth wouldn’t want to live day to day. There isn’t a way to grow without having some kind of savings or investments which makes it paramount that, people should always find ways to cut down for investment purposes it’s a sacrifice to safe guard your future.

The mistake lots of investor made in the past and I think lots of potential future investors are in that category, is waiting to get rich or richer before investing in Bitcoin, I think it should be constantly being talked about in our societies that Bitcoin investment is not for the rich, their are lots of people who see a potential and need to invest but I waiting to get richer without knowing that the price of Bitcoin is not a barrier for the poor or average person, it's an investment opportunity so it's put cash into it periodically according to the person income and watch it grow for years, well ignorance they say is disease.

You are right with your point actually what we don't know is bigger than us at first i use to think the same that bitcoin is very expensive not know that one can actually buy bitcoin fraction by fraction we don't necessarily need to rich before we can start accumulating Bitcoin as bitcoin investment is for both the rich and poor, many people has the zeal to invest but the thought of thinking that bitcoin is too expensive has been a barrier to them, waiting to get rich is never solution when the can start accumulating using the DCA strategy to gradually accumulate either every weeks or months.

Bitcoin should be easy to accumulate for anyone of any income, just like someone with a very small amount of discretionary income might find that amount very small for the rich. The thing that Bitcoin investors should consider is consistent accumulation no matter what the amount. The kind of strategy that is expected for wealthy investors may be the opposite for poor investors but I think that the money measuring skill (rich or poor investors) should not be considered to bring the holdings to a decent level. At the end of the day the investor who can finish each cycle brilliantly over the long term is successful.

You are right that you do not need to be rich to start Bitcoin. If someone has any amount of discretionary income and is mentally prepared to manage for the long term then he can easily reach at the desired point. Therefore, among the things that he should be aware of are emergency funds and saving regardless of value.

[Stormisover]

When it’s about stating hypothesis, everything goes and what I really think is that, it doesn’t matter how one earns or how small the amount might be. Someone who is really concerned about growth wouldn’t want to live day to day. There isn’t a way to grow without having some kind of savings or investments which makes it paramount that, people should always find ways to cut down for investment purposes it’s a sacrifice to safe guard your future.

The mistake lots of investor made in the past and I think lots of potential future investors are in that category, is waiting to get rich or richer before investing in Bitcoin, I think it should be constantly being talked about in our societies that Bitcoin investment is not for the rich, their are lots of people who see a potential and need to invest but I waiting to get richer without knowing that the price of Bitcoin is not a barrier for the poor or average person, it's an investment opportunity so it's put cash into it periodically according to the person income and watch it grow for years, well ignorance they say is disease.

You are right with your point actually what we don't know is bigger than us at first i use to think the same that bitcoin is very expensive not know that one can actually buy bitcoin fraction by fraction we don't necessarily need to rich before we can start accumulating Bitcoin as bitcoin investment is for both the rich and poor, many people has the zeal to invest but the thought of thinking that bitcoin is too expensive has been a barrier to them, waiting to get rich is never solution when the can start accumulating using the DCA strategy to gradually accumulate either every weeks or months.

Bitcoin should be easy to accumulate for anyone of any income, just like someone with a very small amount of discretionary income might find that amount very small for the rich. The thing that Bitcoin investors should consider is consistent accumulation no matter what the amount. The kind of strategy that is expected for wealthy investors may be the opposite for poor investors but I think that the money measuring skill (rich or poor investors) should not be considered to bring the holdings to a decent level. At the end of the day the investor who can finish each cycle brilliantly over the long term is successful.

You are right that you do not need to be rich to start Bitcoin. If someone has any amount of discretionary income and is mentally prepared to manage for the long term then he can easily reach at the desired point. Therefore, among the things that he should be aware of are emergency funds and saving regardless of value.

Another important thing as reminders is that a high and profound precedence should always be giving to taken care of basic needs before talking about investment, I have learnt  that DCA does not need to be regular for it to be considered or count DCA, so there is no need neglecting taken care of basic needs at any point to fulfill investment plans, another thing to be aware of is patient because the journey can become longer than expected and all your investment financial decisions must be according to your own ability.

[Merit.s]

In Bitcoin investment, the amount of your income does not matter, whatever your income is, if everything can run smoothly through proper financial management, then DCA is definitely possible even with a very small amount of money, in the case of DCA, no matter how much money you invest, it does not matter, in DCA you only need to buy consistently and hold it for the long term, whether you are rich or not, whether you have large capital or small, create a stable source of income and start DCA, hold it for the long term without worrying about short-term gains, because through this your wealth will continue to grow over time, as a result, it will bring a huge profit after a long time.

You don't need to create or have a stable source of income before you can start your bitcoin investment with DCA. What is needed is a source of income and a discretionary income discretionary income  for you to get started be it stable or not. I know of someone who has a stable source of income but he leaves on debt before he gets his next pay because his stable income does not have a discretionary income. Such person cannot invest invest into bitcoin until he upgrade his him by looking for a second means of income which will give him his discretionary income.

[ejikeme24]

 you don’t even have to been wealthy to be able to accumulate Bitcoin all what is just required is to have a discretionary funds to invest with boom you’re good to go it doesn’t have to be on a daily basis, depending on when you’ve a discretionary funds to continue accumulating bitcoin gradually and to hodl for a longer term period.

Instead of going with the method of investing today and still wait until you have a discretionary fund, why don't you hold on until you get a good source of income even if it is not stable, because investing today and still wait until you get a discretionary income is as if we are just joking with our bitcoin investment. However, bitcoin investment is all about being consistent to maintain our weekly/ monthly routine. If not for the fact that everyone is trying to acquire a little portion of it, I would've say that one need to be financially stable Before getting started, to avoid facing unnecessary challenges, But since there has been a massive increase in the value over the year everyone is rushing to get started so as to avoid late entry.

[Ruttoshi]

 you don’t even have to been wealthy to be able to accumulate Bitcoin all what is just required is to have a discretionary funds to invest with boom you’re good to go it doesn’t have to be on a daily basis, depending on when you’ve a discretionary funds to continue accumulating bitcoin gradually and to hodl for a longer term period.

Instead of going with the method of investing today and still wait until you have a discretionary fund, why don't you hold on until you get a good source of income even if it is not stable, because investing today and still wait until you get a discretionary income is as if we are just joking with our bitcoin investment.

I see that you don't understand the meaning of discretionary income and that's why you feel that one discretionary income is not important before you can invest into bitcoin. Whether you have a stable source of income or not, you need to have a discretionary income from you stable source of income or unstable source of income before you can start up your bitcoin invest. Discretionary income is the extra money that is left, after you must have taken care of your monthly expenses and basic needs. It's that extra funds that you need to invest with. Some people use this extra cash to do whatever they want but it's wise to put yours into bitcoin weekly/monthly overtime.

However, an investor needs to wait for his next discretionary income in other for him to continue his bitcoin accumulation if he has already used the one that he has at that moment.

[Proty]

I see that you don't understand the meaning of discretionary income and that's why you feel that one discretionary income is not important before you can invest into bitcoin. Whether you have a stable source of income or not, you need to have a discretionary income from you stable source of income or unstable source of income before you can start up your bitcoin invest. Discretionary income is the extra money that is left, after you must have taken care of your monthly expenses and basic needs. It's that extra funds that you need to invest with. Some people use this extra cash to do whatever they want but it's wise to put yours into bitcoin weekly/monthly overtime.

However, an investor needs to wait for his next discretionary income in other for him to continue his bitcoin accumulation if he has already used the one that he has at that moment.

There are many that don't understand what discretionary income is before entering into bitcoin investment and this is wrong since  it is advisable to invest using our discretionary income.
Discretionary income is the money that we have left after sorting out all our expenses like food, house rent, school fees etc.
So discretionary income is what we should invest into bitcoin to have a stress free investment. Regardless of whether we are earning high we shouldn't invest more than our discretionary income and this is after we have sort out our expenses.

[laijsica]

 you don’t even have to been wealthy to be able to accumulate Bitcoin all what is just required is to have a discretionary funds to invest with boom you’re good to go it doesn’t have to be on a daily basis, depending on when you’ve a discretionary funds to continue accumulating bitcoin gradually and to hodl for a longer term period.

Instead of going with the method of investing today and still wait until you have a discretionary fund, why don't you hold on until you get a good source of income even if it is not stable, because investing today and still wait until you get a discretionary income is as if we are just joking with our bitcoin investment. However, bitcoin investment is all about being consistent to maintain our weekly/ monthly routine. If not for the fact that everyone is trying to acquire a little portion of it, I would've say that one need to be financially stable Before getting started, to avoid facing unnecessary challenges, But since there has been a massive increase in the value over the year everyone is rushing to get started so as to avoid late entry.

Bitcoin should not be a hindrance to a stable source of income. There are many holders who have developed the tendency of accumulation while they are still in studying. They have not yet started earning money by accumulation Bitcoin through a discretionary fund while studying but they are practicing extra to strengthen their financial system for the future. You will be left behind in the competition with those budding investors because they have taken up the challenge of becoming economically self-sufficient while still in studying and this method allows them to find a steady source of income by investing their allocated money (parental given allocation) towards Bitcoin accumulation.

The main reason why many people who were supposed to set aside time for investment fail to protect the given return is because they spend their time busy with alternative income and try to increase the amount of discretionary income more by not starting initially, but those investors should have developed the pattern of accumulation any amount of Bitcoin regardless of the price.

[Tungbulu]

This is wrong too.. since discretionary income comes after taking out basic expenses.

There are some expenses that come before discretionary income (such as food, water, shelter and things that cannot be cut) and their are other expenses that come after discretionary income (such as going out to eat, cigarettes, the costs of a luxury car versus a more practical car/transportation,).. We might not always agree on which of the expenses come before discretionary income and are mandatory expenses and which ones come after discretionary income, so for example if a person chooses a house that is $3k per month rent, even though they could reasonably live in a house with $500 per month rent, then $500 might come before discretionary income and the other $2,500 per month would come after discretionary income.. and of course, some of us will lock in our expenses in ways that it is difficult to change them in a short period of time and we sometimes might consider some of our luxuries as if they were essentials... but those are personal choices in which some guys might be able to generate more discretionmary income by increasing income and/or by cutting some expenses .. especially the non-essential expenses.

Thanks a lot for the clarification, it makes more sense now. You've indeed provided a clearer analysis of managing expenses and income, also extensively emphasized the distinction between expenses that are essential and those that are discretionary. Your approach shows how important it is to prioritize essential expenses such as food, shelter and other basic needs, while also acknowledging the fact that some expenses can be flexible or even optional and that makes a lot of sense.

Your emphasis on the role of debt repayment, savings and emergency funds in personal finance is also well noted. It's true that debt repayment can also be both essential expenses (minimum payments) and can also fall under discretionary expenses ( paying off debt early). And you did a very wonderful job by illustrating this point with the example of the $100 monthly payment on a $2,100 loan.

I appreciate how well you've considered the nuances of managing one's finances, including the effects of variability and uncertainty of one's income on expenses. I've also noted your concept of float funds, that is money that hasn't been allocated to the discretionary income yet, and I find it really interesting too, because it really highlights the importance of adapting to changing circumstances in one's finances.

This approach seems to prioritize financial stability and flexibility,  at the same time acknowledging the fact that different individuals have their own different financial goals and priorities and by striking a balance between essential and discretionary expenses, folks can be able to make more informed decisions about income allocation and how to achieve their long term financial goals without feeling much financial pressure.
One aspect of your perspective that really resonates with me is the fact that expenses can be both essential and discretionary, depending on the individual circumstances, and I believe this was the area I was having confusion.

But I've only got one question that I believe not just me but others would love to know and gain clarity on. The question is, how individuals can be able to balance the need to build an emergency fund and pay off high interest loans, particularly when the loan repayment amount is actually fixed, but the emergency fund allocations can be flexible? Would you advice prioritizing loan repayment over building the emergency fund or would it be more appropriate to simultaneously do both and what factor would you advice to be considered when making the decision?

[Tmoonz]

 you don’t even have to been wealthy to be able to accumulate Bitcoin all what is just required is to have a discretionary funds to invest with boom you’re good to go it doesn’t have to be on a daily basis, depending on when you’ve a discretionary funds to continue accumulating bitcoin gradually and to hodl for a longer term period.

Instead of going with the method of investing today and still wait until you have a discretionary fund, why don't you hold on until you get a good source of income even if it is not stable, because investing today and still wait until you get a discretionary income is as if we are just joking with our bitcoin investment. However, bitcoin investment is all about being consistent to maintain our weekly/ monthly routine. If not for the fact that everyone is trying to acquire a little portion of it, I would've say that one need to be financially stable Before getting started, to avoid facing unnecessary challenges, But since there has been a massive increase in the value over the year everyone is rushing to get started so as to avoid late entry.

I will not even say that everyone is rushing to get started it is not a competition and i will say it should be a decision to be taken with certain level of readiness because rushing in without planning because the price of Bitcoin is increasing will only end in rushing out, for those that have the discretionary income income they can start without seeing it as a rush since seeing it as a rush can lead to making an impulsive decision, it is an individual journey that you needed to run in your own lane and time without pressures of any sorts, not even because everyone else around you is doing it.

[Jostern]

 you don’t even have to been wealthy to be able to accumulate Bitcoin all what is just required is to have a discretionary funds to invest with boom you’re good to go it doesn’t have to be on a daily basis, depending on when you’ve a discretionary funds to continue accumulating bitcoin gradually and to hodl for a longer term period.

Instead of going with the method of investing today and still wait until you have a discretionary fund, why don't you hold on until you get a good source of income even if it is not stable, because investing today and still wait until you get a discretionary income is as if we are just joking with our bitcoin investment. However, bitcoin investment is all about being consistent to maintain our weekly/ monthly routine. If not for the fact that everyone is trying to acquire a little portion of it, I would've say that one need to be financially stable Before getting started, to avoid facing unnecessary challenges, But since there has been a massive increase in the value over the year everyone is rushing to get started so as to avoid late entry.

Bitcoin should not be a hindrance to a stable source of income. There are many holders who have developed the tendency of accumulation while they are still in studying. They have not yet started earning money by accumulation Bitcoin through a discretionary fund while studying but they are practicing extra to strengthen their financial system for the future. You will be left behind in the competition with those budding investors because they have taken up the challenge of becoming economically self-sufficient while still in studying and this method allows them to find a steady source of income by investing their allocated money (parental given allocation) towards Bitcoin accumulation.

The main reason why many people who were supposed to set aside time for investment fail to protect the given return is because they spend their time busy with alternative income and try to increase the amount of discretionary income more by not starting initially, but those investors should have developed the pattern of accumulation any amount of Bitcoin regardless of the price.

Stable source of income shouldn't be a hindrance to why someone who is interested in Bitcoin shouldn't invest, because Bitcoin has been made in such a way that if you're a low income earner or a no coiner whose interest is to invest and accumulate for a longer term which I think its quite possible to invest if you have a discretionary funds to invest with, I believe all what you need to start an investment is just a discretionary funds, Bitcoin is made for everyone that is for the poor and the rich who wants to invest, that is why there are different method just like the DCA which you can invest and keep accumulating fracton by fraction until when you have a higher financial plans to increase your accumulation. Most importantly investing for a long term should also be the priority to maximize risk.

[JayJuanGee]

[edited out]

One aspect of your perspective that really resonates with me is the fact that expenses can be both essential and discretionary, depending on the individual circumstances, and I believe this was the area I was having confusion.

Sometimes these matters can be difficult to communicate in the abstract, since even though we likely realize that individuals are quirky (including recognizing that same kind of quirky characteristic within ourselves), there are still some folks who are better able to deal with various kinds of subtleties in regards to their own expenses, and even learn to rethink their own managing of their expenses based on their spending some time to rethink how they might have had prefiouysly been considering which of their expenses they might have had previously considered to be mandatory and for what reason.

Even some guys who seem to have some pretty bad spending habits and seemingly poor priority choices (and even difficulties deferring gratification), they may be able still learn from a process of spending a bit of time reflecting on their own budget and/or practices.. and so maybe they don't want to sit down for 2-3 hours per week, but they might be willing to compromise and sit down for 1 hour per week (extra beyond whatever budgeting that they are already doing) and just spend that time reflecting on their various income pieces and their various expenses, and maybe brainstorm about some ways that they can increase their income and/or maybe some ways that they might be able to cut some expenses.. and surely if they sit down and they reflect on their own situation and maybe even jot out some notes, any change that they end up choosing to make ends up coming through their own justification that they are the one who had thought through their own personal situation and had considered some ways of trying to improve it.

So maybe we have a guy who smokes and drinks a lot, and he realize that these are largely bad for him and for his budget, yet on previous occasions, he had refused to  cut either of them from his budget and/or lifestyle because he considered that they were his way of blowing off steam, socializing and just he felt that he got a lot of pleasure from the drinking and cigarettes.  He had been considering his cigarettes and his alcohol as mandatory expenses rather than optional expenses.

He had previously not had limitations on his cigarettes and drinking, yet on review he noticed that there was quite a bit of variance with the smoking, anywhere between $5 and $45 every two weeks with an average of around $21 every two weeks.  Upon reflection he sees that he had quite a bit of potential room for improvement for his budget and from his further consideration of the matter, and that it would not really cramp his lifestyle in any kind of meaningful way to cut back a bit and perhaps to limit his 2-week maximum to $18.  He considers that the money saved (and to be able to invest) may well really justify any inconveniences.  So maybe he would even consider shooting for a two-week target of somewhere between $5 and $10.. and so even though he had established some targets, he considers these to be fairly good exercises to help him to place some reasonable self-imposed limiits.

Maybe the guy considers similarly in regards to alcohol.. .. and surely once he goes through the process regarding certain of his more common expenses, then he can use a similar process for other expenses.

He might look at his junk food.  His transportation expenses.  His vacations.  His frequency of eating out versus eating in or packing his lunch.

He might look at his clothing, and his various household expenses.  He might look at his phones and computers, even his coffee consumption.

So initially, the exercise may well was to distinguish between basic and not basic kinds of expenses and to attempt to figure out why some of the expenses had been considered as basic, but then some of his expenses he realize are mixed with basic and non-basic and he may well need to rethink how he thinks about some of his expenses and what purpose some of them have, including his housing choices, food choices and energy consumption that might seem to be basic expenses, yet even within some of the basic expenses there might be ways to cut or reformulate some of those expenses.

But I've only got one question that I believe not just me but others would love to know and gain clarity on. The question is, how individuals can be able to balance the need to build an emergency fund and pay off high interest loans, particularly when the loan repayment amount is actually fixed, but the emergency fund allocations can be flexible? Would you advice prioritizing loan repayment over building the emergency fund or would it be more appropriate to simultaneously do both and what factor would you advice to be considered when making the decision?

Frequently the trade offs will depend on the particulars such as considering the fees, and many folks may already know folks who get into problems with their cashflow management, including their historically having had used debt to consume or even using debt to invest, but their investment went bad and maybe they were gambling with their investment money rather than really being prudent.  So then they may well have several kinds of debt, and some of them have higher interest rates than others, so usually there would be a justification to pay off the higher interest rate ones first, even if there might be some other attributes to them that are advantages, such as flexible payment options or that they are have very long timelines before they have to be completely paid off.  

Of course, if we are thinking about emergency funds versus debt servicing, the debt servicing has an interest rate, so there would be some desire to pay it off, yet we still might want to compare that to our investments too.. and with bitcoin we have a place to put value that likely will have greater than a 10% annualized return rate, yet any money that we put into bitcoin ends up being locked up 4-10 years or longer and we are not even guaranteed to receive the greater than 10% annualized returns that we consider to be likely, yet at the same time, we likely could put the expected returns into a probability calculator to help us to determine which debts to pay off first or to consider how important it is to have an emergency fund, when the emergency fund may well end up being 3 months of expenses in cash and the emergency fund is not likely to be earning any amount of returns, since it is in cash.  The purpose of the emergency fund, is of course, to be able to last 3 months or even longer during periods of uncertainty, and we might even have some other resources that we can draw upon so that we don't have to dip into our bitcoin investment, so the emergency fund might serve as a kind of quickie (and easy to access) resource that lessens the likelihood that we are going to have dip into our bitcoin at a time that is not of our choosing.. and maybe we also hold some stocks and bonds, and some of those could be liquidated too.. but if we run out of everything to liquidate, then out bitcoin might be our last recourse before we might end up homeless or otherwise suffering ramifications of no longer having money and/or no longer having anyone willing to pay for our expenses and/or to bail  us out.

Hopefully by inference I have addressed the issue of calculation, and sure sometimes there are priorities in regards to which ones to build up first, and surely a loan/debt that is 4-6% interest per year is way less burdensome than one that is 15% to 24% per year, so we should be able to see that there is a bit of justification regarding which debts to pay off first, and surely sometimes our emergency fund might suffer and/or our bitcoin might suffer.. and surely in these bitcoin sections of the forum, we are trying to emphasize on getting started wiht bitcoin, yet surely if we have ourselves in a pretty bad situation, our ability to start out aggressively on bitcoin or even to really shore up our emergency funds, we might be balancing with inferior circumstances and/or even dilemmas regarding which ones are more important to fix first in the event that we consider that there might be advantages to taking care of the most egregious of circumstances..

 including.. yeah, maybe an example can come in handy.  Let's say if we are making ONLY $500 to $1,500 per month, with a usual income of about $1,100 and our various expenses (prior to our servicing of our debts) are tending to be between $550 and $950 with a usual amount of $750.. ... so we already have variance build in, so we have to make sure that we have plans for the worser scenarios within our income and expenses, but then we also have some debts that we need to pay off.  Maybe we have 3 different debt payments that have a minimum of $20 per month, $40 per month and $70 per month, so our minimums add up to $130 per month, so this has to be taken from our income right away prior to calculating our discretionary income, and within those debts we can choose to pay extra which likely would mean paying off the higher interest rate debts first, and sure maybe some loans could penalize for early payment of debt, so there might not be any incentive to pay early if the loan is already set up to be spread over time without any early payment benefits... and so then the extent to which we service debts with extra (discretionary income versus building our emergency funds, versus investing into bitcoin is likely going to have to do with whether the BTC and the emergency funds are growing at around the same rate and then considering how much each of our loans are costing us.. If they are costing less than 6% annualized, then there might not be any major incentive to pay them off early. .but if they are costing more (such as between 6% and 15%), then the investor might be mixed about whether to focus on paying them off sooner or just paying them off on their regular payment schedule, and surely we then start to get into the 15% to 24% or more, then those higher rate debts are seeming to be quite expensive ways of living that I personally would not be wanting to pay loans with those levels of interest rates, so I personally would be wanting to giving higher priority to paying off loans with those kinds of higher rates.

By the way, there could be some advantage for this thread for any of the members to try to set forth a better flow chart in order to attempt to show how he thinks about the various categories of income versus expenses, versus discretionary funds, floating funds, emergency funds, reserve funds, loan servicing, other discretionary expenses, bitcoin investing, and etc. etc. etc.

[Derekfunds]

 you don’t even have to been wealthy to be able to accumulate Bitcoin all what is just required is to have a discretionary funds to invest with boom you’re good to go it doesn’t have to be on a daily basis, depending on when you’ve a discretionary funds to continue accumulating bitcoin gradually and to hodl for a longer term period.

Instead of going with the method of investing today and still wait until you have a discretionary fund, why don't you hold on until you get a good source of income even if it is not stable, because investing today and still wait until you get a discretionary income is as if we are just joking with our bitcoin investment. However, bitcoin investment is all about being consistent to maintain our weekly/ monthly routine. If not for the fact that everyone is trying to acquire a little portion of it, I would've say that one need to be financially stable Before getting started, to avoid facing unnecessary challenges, But since there has been a massive increase in the value over the year everyone is rushing to get started so as to avoid late entry.

Bitcoin should not be a hindrance to a stable source of income. There are many holders who have developed the tendency of accumulation while they are still in studying. They have not yet started earning money by accumulation Bitcoin through a discretionary fund while studying but they are practicing extra to strengthen their financial system for the future. You will be left behind in the competition with those budding investors because they have taken up the challenge of becoming economically self-sufficient while still in studying and this method allows them to find a steady source of income by investing their allocated money (parental given allocation) towards Bitcoin accumulation.

The main reason why many people who were supposed to set aside time for investment fail to protect the given return is because they spend their time busy with alternative income and try to increase the amount of discretionary income more by not starting initially, but those investors should have developed the pattern of accumulation any amount of Bitcoin regardless of the price.

Stable source of income shouldn't be a hindrance to why someone who is interested in Bitcoin shouldn't invest, because Bitcoin has been made in such a way that if you're a low income earner or a no coiner whose interest is to invest and accumulate for a longer term which I think its quite possible to invest if you have a discretionary funds to invest with, I believe all what you need to start an investment is just a discretionary funds, Bitcoin is made for everyone that is for the poor and the rich who wants to invest, that is why there are different method just like the DCA which you can invest and keep accumulating fracton by fraction until when you have a higher financial plans to increase your accumulation. Most importantly investing for a long term should also be the priority to maximize risk.

Don't not confuse yourself, long term investment help to minimize risk and not to maximize it because when you say maximize it means increasing risk which is not correct ( wrong) because if risk is been maximize then there's no difference between us ( investors) and traders. In addition, our discretionary comes from our income and if we don't have source of income then investing is not possible and again don't confuse yourself when they say Bitcoin investment is for both poor and the rich, it doesn't mean that anybody can go and invest, that person that will go and invest simply because of that term, will end up losing everything ( both his or her investment and other savings they have). When they say both poor and rich there are level of poor they are talking about.

[Tungbulu]

Frequently the trade offs will depend on the particulars such as considering the fees, and many folks may already know folks who get into problems with their cashflow management, including their historically having had used debt to consume or even using debt to invest, but their investment went bad and maybe they were gambling with their investment money rather than really being prudent.  So then they may well have several kinds of debt, and some of them have higher interest rates than others, so usually there would be a justification to pay off the higher interest rate ones first, even if there might be some other attributes to them that are advantages, such as flexible payment options or that they are have very long timelines before they have to be completely paid off.  

Of course, if we are thinking about emergency funds versus debt servicing, the debt servicing has an interest rate, so there would be some desire to pay it off, yet we still might want to compare that to our investments too.. and with bitcoin we have a place to put value that likely will have greater than a 10% annualized return rate, yet any money that we put into bitcoin ends up being locked up 4-10 years or longer and we are not even guaranteed to receive the greater than 10% annualized returns that we consider to be likely, yet at the same time, we likely could put the expected returns into a probability calculator to help us to determine which debts to pay off first or to consider how important it is to have an emergency fund, when the emergency fund may well end up being 3 months of expenses in cash and the emergency fund is not likely to be earning any amount of returns, since it is in cash.  The purpose of the emergency fund, is of course, to be able to last 3 months or even longer during periods of uncertainty, and we might even have some other resources that we can draw upon so that we don't have to dip into our bitcoin investment, so the emergency fund might serve as a kind of quickie (and easy to access) resource that lessens the likelihood that we are going to have dip into our bitcoin at a time that is not of our choosing.. and maybe we also hold some stocks and bonds, and some of those could be liquidated too.. but if we run out of everything to liquidate, then out bitcoin might be our last recourse before we might end up homeless or otherwise suffering ramifications of no longer having money and/or no longer having anyone willing to pay for our expenses and/or to bail  us out.

Hopefully by inference I have addressed the issue of calculation, and sure sometimes there are priorities in regards to which ones to build up first, and surely a loan/debt that is 4-6% interest per year is way less burdensome than one that is 15% to 24% per year, so we should be able to see that there is a bit of justification regarding which debts to pay off first, and surely sometimes our emergency fund might suffer and/or our bitcoin might suffer.. and surely in these bitcoin sections of the forum, we are trying to emphasize on getting started wiht bitcoin, yet surely if we have ourselves in a pretty bad situation, our ability to start out aggressively on bitcoin or even to really shore up our emergency funds, we might be balancing with inferior circumstances and/or even dilemmas regarding which ones are more important to fix first in the event that we consider that there might be advantages to taking care of the most egregious of circumstances..

 

Let's also consider another scenario where an individual has acquired multiple debts with different interest rates.
 For example, let's say the guy in question has a credit card with 20% interest rate, a non collateral loan with a 10% interest rate and a mortgage with maybe around 6% interest rate. He also have a potential investment opportunity which could yield potential returns of higher than 10% annually, but comes with a few significant risks and liquidity constraints.

In this scenario, I believe it might make more sense to prioritize debt repayment, especially for the one that has the highest interest rate, which is the credit with the 20% interest rate. Although, if the guy in question is expecting returns from his investment to consistently outpace the interest rates on their debts, then they could consider allocating funds to the investment instead.
I believe the role of an emergency fund would also become very crucial here, because it'll be providing a safety net to avoid liquidating his investment incase of potential downturns. A 3 months emergency fund in cash might not really earn any significant returns but at least it can do well to offer liquidity and potentially reduce the need to tap into one's Bitcoin or other investments during uncertain periods.
Although, this could vary from person to person because the decision depends on the individual's financial goals, risk tolerance and priorities.