Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[erk]

Well there'll be ROI, just negative (if we are unlucky). You all mean break-even, right?  

According to the genesis block, no. No breaking even unless hash rate increase or BTC price increase.

And it also doesn't factor in the effect of your KNCminer purchase has on the hash rate.

[r3animation]

Well there'll be ROI, just negative (if we are unlucky). You all mean break-even, right?  

According to the genesis block, no. No breaking even unless hash rate increase or BTC price increase.

please stop inaba bullshit, lol

?

I'm just saying that's the only way to break-even with the current hash rate of the miners or you didn't read my statement properly.

[r3animation]

Well there'll be ROI, just negative (if we are unlucky). You all mean break-even, right?  

According to the genesis block, no. No breaking even unless hash rate increase or BTC price increase.

And it also doesn't factor in the effect of your KNCminer purchase has on the hash rate.

Sadly true.

[Xialla]

yes, it sucks.

I hope, that they will announce some program/future discounts for 1st/2nd day guys, because these guys helps them to establish the company and paid everything.

KNC should send Day1/Day 2 customers, a Jupiter of they ordered a Saturn and a Saturn+Jupiter if they ordered a Jupiter.  

why not? their profit on every machine is in hundreds of % and if they want to retain customers, at least 1st/2nd day shipping must be with positive ROI.

[Xialla]

No breaking even unless hash rate increase or BTC price increase.

I paid 85BTC so I need to mine at least 85BTC back for break-even. it is fucking simple, isn't it?

[Miz4r]

Well there'll be ROI, just negative (if we are unlucky). You all mean break-even, right?  

No we mean ROI. Negative ROI is no ROI.

[btc_uzr]

pfuuu...seems like most are missing a tiny but very important fact when shouting at each other, which could relax the whole situation dramatically.

Please consider there are several kind of people involved.
Not all are in the same position, we all are individuals keep it in mind before starting the next fight.

1) ppl who do not care that much about ROI, some have fun mining and to be part of the cryptocoin movement
2) ppl who invested in hope they might get a good deal with up to %50 on top of investment
3) ppl who got sucked into this by their greed or where mislead by lies and dream of a lot of money

Number 1 customers stick to their order.
Number 2 is partially jumping the ship as losses seem to be way more likely than a ROI atm (may change)
Number 3 should get a refund now if not done,yet


I share both perspectives (1+2) at the same time with weighted priority based on amount spend.

I had one device for myself (canceled). I invested with the awareness of a total loss and in hope of profit.
However I still do not want to risk my money on a bet I will loose way more likely than it works out. Therefore canceled.

Then I have another one as groupbuy in place going to be shipped.
The Groupbuy was made with 'real life' friends who are all totally aware that it's high risk investment.
They know they might loose everything, but they are ok with it as they want to support the cryptocoin movement and still have somehow hope that in some years it might pay out...if not, nobody worries.  And they don't give shit about our forum talks.

---

Another aspect of this story is that we all (KnC & customers) could make profit, but currently it looks like KnC only, no?
In combination with their claim of 'under promise, over delivery' and being late on news about current state of progress, this has a very bad taste and it's not surprising that ppl jump the ship.

Honestly I'm still in hope that KnC will surprise its customers, because for some strange reason my gut tells me ppl receiving orders will be happy.
Nevertheless I've canceled my device, because there's no rational reason for me at this point in time not to do so - maybe I regret it, maybe I won't, but for sure I will decide this way again in a similar situation.

[r3animation]

pfuuu...seems like most are missing a tiny but very important fact when shouting at each other, which could relax the whole situation dramatically.

Please consider there are several kind of people involved.
Not all are in the same position, we all are individuals keep it in mind before starting the next fight.

1) ppl who do not care that much about ROI, some have fun mining and to be part of the cryptocoin movement
2) ppl who invested in hope they might get a good deal with up to %50 on top of investment
3) ppl who got sucked into this by their greed or where mislead by lies and dream of a lot of money

Number 1 customers stick to their order.
Number 2 is partially jumping the ship as losses seem to be way more likely than a ROI atm (may change)
Number 3 should get a refund now if not done,yet


I share both perspectives (1+2) at the same time with weighted priority based on amount spend.

I had one device for myself (canceled). I invested with the awareness of a total loss and in hope of profit.
However I still do not want to risk my money on a bet I will loose way more likely than it works out. Therefore canceled.

Then I have another one as groupbuy in place going to be shipped.
The Groupbuy was made with 'real life' friends who are all totally aware that it's high risk investment.
They know they might loose everything, but they are ok with it as they want to support the cryptocoin movement and still have somehow hope that in some years it might pay out...if not, nobody worries.  And they don't give shit about our forum talks.

---

Another aspect of this story is that we all (KnC & customers) could make profit, but currently it looks like KnC only, no?
In combination with their claim of 'under promise, over delivery' and being late on news about current state of progress, this has a very bad taste and it's not surprising that ppl jump the ship.

Honestly I'm still in hope that KnC will surprise its customers, because for some strange reason my gut tells me ppl receiving orders will be happy.
Nevertheless I've canceled my device, because there's no rational reason for me at this point in time not to do so - maybe I regret it, maybe I won't, but for sure I will decide this way again in a similar situation.

Well reasoned. I'm probably no.2 in your list and I do hope that KNC does over-deliver at this point as I'm still keeping my order.

[markm]

No breaking even unless hash rate increase or BTC price increase.

I paid 85BTC so I need to mine at least 85BTC back for break-even. it is fucking simple, isn't it?

Why does everyone go on about how a bitcoin increase would help?

Think about, a bitcoin decrease could work too: you could mine $85, bitcoin drop to $1 per bitcoin, buy 85 bitcoins.

Just as reasonable as doing it by bitcoin increasing, it just takes converting to dollars and back instead of only to dollars and stopping there.

(For "just as reasonable" the reader might be well advised to read "just as unreasonable" but maybe that is a matter of taste/tastelessness.)

-MarkM-

[bbxx]

please Bitcoinrama come back to work!!!

you are the only left, lol.

[Nemo1024]

Well there'll be ROI, just negative (if we are unlucky). You all mean break-even, right?  

No we mean ROI. Negative ROI is no ROI.

If your return on your investment is less than what you initially invested, then you have a negative ROI.
If equal, then you reached a break-even point.
If more, then you attained a positive return on your investment.

Next time someone talks or tries to write about "not reaching ROI", stop and think. Think specifically of those yellow long bendy fruit everyone calls apples in your tribe (never mind that the rest of the world calls them bananas).

[crumbs]

Well there'll be ROI, just negative (if we are unlucky). You all mean break-even, right?  

No we mean ROI. Negative ROI is no ROI.

If your return on your investment is less than what you initially invested, then you have a negative ROI.
If equal, then you reached a break-even point.
If more, then you attained a positive return on your investment.

Next time someone talks or tries to write about "not reaching ROI", stop and think. Think specifically of those yellow long bendy fruit everyone calls apples in your tribe (never mind that the rest of the world calls them bananas).

In my tribe, if i ask for bananas, i'm sure to get an apple, therein lies the rub.  Wut do
Edit:  Now that you corrected my tribe, my life is chaos. ~Half of the people started using your "correct," intertribal terminology.  No matter what i ask for, what i get's a total crapshoot.

[Miz4r]

Well there'll be ROI, just negative (if we are unlucky). You all mean break-even, right?  

No we mean ROI. Negative ROI is no ROI.

If your return on your investment is less than what you initially invested, then you have a negative ROI.
If equal, then you reached a break-even point.
If more, then you attained a positive return on your investment.

Next time someone talks or tries to write about "not reaching ROI", stop and think. Think specifically of those yellow long bendy fruit everyone calls apples in your tribe (never mind that the rest of the world calls them bananas).

Please reread what I wrote, there was not a word wrong in it and I will keep using ROI the way I want to thank you. I get tired of you people constantly trying to correct everyone supposedly using ROI in the wrong way, when there's actually nothing wrong with it but you're just too anally retentive to see that.

[btc_uzr]

Stop it, please. Don't you read 10 pages back ?
We had this ROI crap now several times over and over.
https://asktom.cf/index.php?topic=170332.msg3233182#msg3233182

[nightengale]

I don't post very frequently on this thread, but KnC should probably come up with some news pretty quick. The FUD is getting pretty deep here on bitcointalk, and if ROI is becoming more elusive with their machines I don't they'll be able to make it any better than we will.

[demonmaestro]

Well so far if you want an update.. here you go. Every day there is about 10 pages of crap. everyday.  Why cant everyone just chill and wait to see what happens?

[AussieHash]

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/40083c6e43

jupiter with hosting
90BTC
not looking good...

- 48btc

Could be worse, could be this guy
https://asktom.cf/index.php?topic=292998.msg3143055#msg3143055

[thy]

Welcome to the world class thinkers, "I can get something for nothing" crowd...

It's not me supporting the guys at the TOP of the PYRAMID! - Not anymore!
So, who is working for the "dark side"? Well, those funding the preorders for the ASIC Companies, who will make THEM Millionaires while making all of you SLAVES, hashing at a fraction of the capacity you bought into, while GIVING ENERGY, (FORCE) to those WHO CONTROL YOU!

For me, No thanks!
I retook my power from the evil dark side of ASIC mining companies.  

My feelings exactly - ASICs opened the doors to the worst scams of them all - this was never possible in the GPU days -
everybody had access to real hardware vendors, not these these wannabe pretenders.  The verdict on KNC is still out,
I did consider them back in May, but decided against it when they pulled the plug on the FPGA Litecoin miner.
Instead I decided to pursue the Avalon group-buy DIY route - with a reputable organizer (Zefir) - well at least I received
a full refund from Zefir - thank you again.

At this time it does not make sense to buy any mining product, especially a pre-order, as all ASIC manufacturers use their
profits to mine, or even worse, use your pre-ordered equipment to mine (Avalon). and then don't even have the decency
to clean them up, before finally shipping them to their customers.

I am not saying that KNC is like Avalon, but their September shipping date is already moved at best to September 30, if
this month at all.  Remember, every ASIC manufacturer is above all else your competition in this game, and they hold
the upper hand.  

They still got thursday friday and monday to ship, if they work weekends to, two more days so they could still deliver before 30 sept.

[efodix]

pfuuu...seems like most are missing a tiny but very important fact when shouting at each other, which could relax the whole situation dramatically.

Please consider there are several kind of people involved.
Not all are in the same position, we all are individuals keep it in mind before starting the next fight.

1) ppl who do not care that much about ROI, some have fun mining and to be part of the cryptocoin movement....

Some fun paying 5000$ so that drug dealers and gamblers can have a safer payment system. I'm sure most people could find better hobbies than that. Like getting drunk on a weekend and spending what's left on a pair of russian hookers. Both hobbies result in a same financial loss, but one leaves you with memories of awesomeness while the other pretty much sums up to..well..nothing.

[thy]

I don't want to be pessimistic, but here are some facts:

https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-36
We will update this news site as often as we can with news. - Nothing new last 9 days?
We will even have some videos this week from our Swedish assembly factory - I saw 10 sec long video with PCB without chip this week. Where are "videos from assembly factory" from last week?
The first chips off of the production line we will run at full speed in our launch video - We are 3 working days (5 days) from deadline. Where is launch video of working unit?

https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-34
Firstly, our orders for September delivery are now closed - I think, that there is a difference between shipping date and delivery date. Yes, KNC promise delivery of unit until September. - they have to process 1st day of shipping until Saturday and 2nd day of shipping until Sunday.

https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-32
Finally we wish to confirm that yes we are still on track for our delivery towards the end of September. - delivery not shipping (again)

@fanclub: there are just facts, you don't need to advocate KNC now.

I think they said they were on a tight schedule, hopefully they will get there ASICs out as scheduled, but one could guess that they will have a video up on the first device running probably the day before first shipping date or maby even the same day just a few hours before they ship, who knows ?

It woulden't be supprising if they are going to work weekends to during the first batches 15-20 days or so shipping windows, but even if they dont they still have thursday, friday and monday to start the delivery on.
Im pretty sure there should be people in Sweden on day 1 that should get there device the same day it's shipped if the first days delivery is sent early in the morning and some people in Sweden(and probably some from other country's to) that bought at least 5-10 machines or so will probably go and pick up there machines in person at KnC's place in Stockholm on there shippmentdate(to earn another 1-2k usd value in extra mined btc's) if there resonably early in the delievery order, so if they send out there first 500 or so day 1 devices even on monday morning there should be people that get there devices up and working in September...