Just-Dice.com : now with added CLAMs : Play or Invest

[theskillzdatklls]

Hey Doog, are you Canadian? Was JD based or hosted in Canada?

http://www.dailydot.com/business/bitcoin-gambling-just-dice-video-casino/
Inside the bustling, dicey world of Bitcoin gambling

The site was founded in June by Chris "dooglus" Moore of British Columbia, Canada, and specializes in a simple dice-rolling game in which the house maintains a slim 1-percent edge.


To gamble with bitcoins is to double down: It’s a wager on top of a risk.

The currency itself, which was created in late 2008 by pseudonymous programmer Satoshi Nakamoto.  In fact, the timing couldn’t have been better. Two years earlier, Congress passed the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act, which prohibited casinos from accepting payments for bets made online. The move pushed online gambling into the corners of the Deep Web, where users are protected by the Tor browser. And it created a high demand for online gambling sites based in Europe and Canada, where the practice is legal.

Thanks - so why doesn't he just sell it to someone if he's not planning to run it anymore?

There's a bunch of reasons that could be it, who cares.

Maybe he wants to keep his options open later, maybe he doesn't want a scammer to hi-jack his software and dupe people, maybe he doesn't care about more money at this point and wants a peaceful existence with his blessed life as is.

I'm sure he'll make whatever choice is best for himself in due time.

[PacoMartin]

Thanks - so why doesn't he just sell it to someone if he's not planning to run it anymore?

I'm sure he's weighing his options. Look at it this way. the Canadian government may decide that dooglus doesn't have to collect personal data on investors of 100BTC or less. Now as of his last report, the investors under 100 BTC summed to only 10,723 BTC out of the bankroll of 53,280 BTC.

Now could he open Just Dice with a 10K bankroll (max profit of 50 BTC). Absolutely. Plus dooglus can't be responsible for people who open up multiple accounts of one satoshi less than 100 BTC.

Personally, I think JD would be more profitable with a smaller bankroll. I think that even with a 50 BTC or a 100 BTC limit, there would be plenty of activity, and return for the investors would be higher since they are split among a smaller group.

Look at the numbers for doge-dice. I know they are very small compared to just-dice, but note that profit is 50% bigger than invested. For just dice the profit was much smaller than the amount invested because of whale activity. If you were an investor of JD for under 100 BTC you would have been smarter to pull it out and invest in doge-dice (assuming bitcoin doesn't keep inflating).

BTC
195,160 wagered
2,272 profit

611,254,823 bets

[PacoMartin]

The way the new law looks to me is that in order to continue "dealing with Bitcoins" Just-Dice would have to start collecting private information from its customers, reporting anyone transferring "suspicious" amounts, and other such invasions of privacy.

That kind of behaviour is not something I would want to be involved in, and so I am asking that you withdraw your coins before they start enforcing the new law.

If you just open up doge-dice and keep investors below the equivalent of 50BTC would that drop below the suspicious level.

while not on the level of JD, it would still be a decent passtime and a good investment opportunity, I counted only 11 investors on doge-dice with over 100 BTC invested, and only 13 with between 50BTC and 100BTC.

195,160 BTC wagered
2,272   BTC profit

[theskillzdatklls]

That doesn't make sense. Just open a bunch of accounts of 90 btc and who would know better. Even idiotic governments would know this.

[minerpumpkin]

I guess he's evaluating the obvious/easiest legal options, whether the site can remain operating in Canada, maybe with minor changes. If this turns out to be futile, he may opt to really go and run the site from somewhere else. Isle of Man, anonymous places... I believe he loves the site, so he won't give it up/away easily.
Again, just hosting the site somewhere legal or unknown and manage/run it from home unnoticed may be illegal and bad advice I'd give to no one *ahem* *ahem*

[PacoMartin]

That doesn't make sense. Just open a bunch of accounts of 90 btc and who would know better. Even idiotic governments would know this.

It's not a question of what can be done, it's a question of responsibility of the web site owner. If the website owner is responsible to ask for a name, and he gets dozens of names generated from a random number generator, is it his responsibility to go through names and see if they realistic names?

In the USA there is an upper limit for private cash transactions. It is $10,000 . Now there are plenty of illegal cash transactions in amounts below $10K, but the government requires you to report to the IRS a cash transaction of $10K or more. There is no presumption of illegal activity. You might pay for an old sports car in cash for some amount over $10K. There is nothing illegal about buying the sports car, but it is illegal to not report the transaction to the IRS.

I am not sure of the law in Canada. Now $10K < 17 BTC. So if dooglus is required to register with the Canadian government every investor deposit of 17 BTC or more, than he probably can't function.

If a more reasonable sum is determined, than he may have a workable business. As of the last report, these are the top investors in doge-coin (expressed in BTC)

693.71
670.22
248.39
233.82
215.62
213.95
189.59
147.65
132.59
116.08
107.97

If he can meet government regulations by restricting investments to the dogecoin equivalent of under 100 BTC, and is only forced to produce a list of investment or withdrawals on demand then he might have a working business model that could operate under the radar.

While some people will be reluctant to turn bitcoins in doge-coins, there may be enough to restore business. Doge-dice made 2200 BTC equivalent in profit, which is a little more than 1/8 of the profit of JD. I don't know how long Doge-dice has been operational.

In general, the government will have to win cases to establish precedents. They are much less likely to go after a dogecoin operation for one of the first test cases. Who wants that story in the news.

[infested999]

That doesn't make sense. Just open a bunch of accounts of 90 btc and who would know better. Even idiotic governments would know this.

It's not a question of what can be done, it's a question of responsibility of the web site owner. If the website owner is responsible to ask for a name, and he gets dozens of names generated from a random number generator, is it his responsibility to go through names and see if they realistic names?

In the USA there is an upper limit for private cash transactions. It is $10,000 . Now there are plenty of illegal cash transactions in amounts below $10K, but the government requires you to report to the IRS a cash transaction of $10K or more. There is no presumption of illegal activity. You might pay for an old sports car in cash for some amount over $10K. There is nothing illegal about buying the sports car, but it is illegal to not report the transaction to the IRS.

I am not sure of the law in Canada. Now $10K < 17 BTC. So if dooglus is required to register with the Canadian government every investor deposit of 17 BTC or more, than he probably can't function.

If a more reasonable sum is determined, than he may have a workable business. As of the last report, these are the top investors in doge-coin (expressed in BTC)

693.71
670.22
248.39
233.82
215.62
213.95
189.59
147.65
132.59
116.08
107.97

If he can meet government regulations by restricting investments to the dogecoin equivalent of under 100 BTC, and is only forced to produce a list of investment or withdrawals on demand then he might have a working business model that could operate under the radar.

While some people will be reluctant to turn bitcoins in doge-coins, there may be enough to restore business. Doge-dice made 2200 BTC equivalent in profit, which is a little more than 1/8 of the profit of JD. I don't know how long Doge-dice has been operational.

In general, the government will have to win cases to establish precedents. They are much less likely to go after a dogecoin operation for one of the first test cases. Who wants that story in the news.

Not going to happen. For this site to be legal has to have a casino license, which would require the RNG to be inspected by a casino inspector (the law doesn't believe in provably fair) and for doog to pay taxes.

[Palantir]

What we need now is a YouTube clip "Hitler is told JD is shutting down". 

[cech4204a]

I cannot believe that the largest site with Dice went out off market. I have played there for 1 whole month and invested some little, i was lucky enough to make some profit. People will now try to invest money in other simmilar sites , but please be carefull, you need investment that is safe, not a scam.

[Lohoris]

you like living in snow?

Don't you think he would have already moved anyway if he wanted to?

[infested999]

Hitler finds out Just-Dice is shutting down

[Swordsoffreedom]

Hitler finds out Just-Dice is shutting down

That Hitler clip always a classic
Nice list of past history and ha-ha I will wait for SS-Dice on Friday 

[infested999]

Hitler finds out Just-Dice is shutting down

That Hitler clip always a classic
Nice list of past history and ha-ha I will wait for SS-Dice on Friday 

卐-Dice

[dooglus]

Site is good enough to trust them, but be carefull what you write on chat-box. I got banned for 1 hour by site owner (Dooglus) for asking if someone has bitcointalk forum account to sell (i guess chat-box is there only for dooglus-ass-lickers and mods in general). And i wagered 140+ BTC till that moment on that site and have been very active there for 1 month. Now i'm gonne, no more bets from my side.

I blocked you from the site's chat after you spammed the poker freeroll we put on as a thank-you to our regular players. I asked you several times to stop posting your donation address over and over but you refused. You shouldn't be surprised if people treat you badly when you act like a dick to them.

you give no fuck about your players, and that includes having mods that dont give a fuck about players (they are just doing by the orders you give them).

I care about all customers of my sites. That's why I had to suspend betting and return their coins. I don't want to be in a position where government agents steal player funds and sell them off to the highest bidder.

I cannot believe that the largest site with Dice went out off market. I have played there for 1 whole month and invested some little, i was lucky enough to make some profit. People will now try to invest money in other simmilar sites , but please be carefull, you need investment that is safe, not a scam.

Yes, be careful out there. I've no idea how to judge which sites are trustworthy. Hopefully some kind of multi-sig solution will emerge which removes the need to trust strangers with your coins.

[infested999]

cold wallet transaction: http://pastie.org/9332437

Code:

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

[infested999]

Code:

02:54:50 (393) <@DeCiB3l> I can probably get a job at a mental heath clinic because of my experience moderating this chat

[PacoMartin]

The way the new law looks to me is that in order to continue "dealing with Bitcoins" Just-Dice would have to start collecting private information from its customers, reporting anyone transferring "suspicious" amounts, and other such invasions of privacy.

That kind of behaviour is not something I would want to be involved in, and so I am asking that you withdraw your coins before they start enforcing the new law.

Can you open doge-dice and limit investments under one account to 100,000,000 DogeCoin? Surely the government doesn't expect you to try and correlate different accounts to look for potential common ownership. How would you do that anyway?

The restriction would by definition be small enough so that there were no suspicious activity of interest to the government. At least some of the smaller players would have a clean well lit place to go.

[zimmah]

In the Netherlands in regular casinos I believe they only have to ask questions if someone brings in over €10.000 at once.

So only allowing deposits up until a set amount per day/month may help avoid this law. But I don't know about Canadian laws. They are pretty weird sometimes.

Do they still offer a horse and a gun to criminals who have sit out their time in jail?

[pawel7777]

Do they still offer a horse and a gun to criminals who have sit out their time in jail?

[zimmah]

Do they still offer a horse and a gun to criminals who have sit out their time in jail?

in Canada there used to be a law (not sure if it's still like that) that said that whenever someone is released from prison they should be given a gun, bullets and a horse so they can travel the roads safely, or something like that.