[ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated]

[WildFire.ca]

Cool, so anyone who doesn't have a photo can just log in to Bitfunder and take those details from their logs.

I read this as a joke.

I wasn't aware taking a picture of the TIME and date of xfer was even asked. Hope Bitfunder comes back up, having to sign a message will be a manual process and will equal a delay

I was asking because I had taken screen grabs but deleted them by mistake when I cleaned up my desktop last week.

You can always ask the NSA for your screen cAps, they have backups of everything.
To the moon baby.

[Vigil]

CRUMBS IS DESPERATE TO BUY YOUR SHARES.

Months of Trolling and EXTREME FUD over the past few weeks and he is TEARING AT THE BIT to get his hands on ACtM shares.

HE IS POSTING ABOUT CRYPOSTOCKS WITHIN MINUTES OF US BEING LISTED!


WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU?

It tells you that EVERYTHING we have been saying for the past weeks is correct.

THIS STOCK IS GOING TO EXPLODE.

You know it and so does CRUMBS - ACtM NO1. TROLL.


I said it last week and I need to say it again to protect those who have been dupped before by these TROLLS - DO NOT sell below 0.007 as this stock is going to 0.04. within the next few weeks.

no accounts created yet

How did these appear?

If it goes to .04 I will sell. that would mean that ActM is worth 1/30th of the total outstanding bitcoins.

[SoylentCreek]

Hang on a tick?  What this about having a record of the transfer to AMC-TENDER?  That wasn't in the original set of instructions.

Investors who fail for any reason to provide the information necessary to obtain "Verified" status on Bitfunder are encouraged to transfer their shares on BitFunder to the Bitfunder user AMC-TENDER no later than November 13, 2013 before dividends are paid.  All Investors transferring their shares to this account will continue to accumulated dividends on their shares. 

[VolanicEruptor]

Hang on a tick?  What this about having a record of the transfer to AMC-TENDER?  That wasn't in the original set of instructions.

Investors who fail for any reason to provide the information necessary to obtain "Verified" status on Bitfunder are encouraged to transfer their shares on BitFunder to the Bitfunder user AMC-TENDER no later than November 13, 2013 before dividends are paid.  All Investors transferring their shares to this account will continue to accumulated dividends on their shares. 

and the big mess begins...

[iamnot_]

Hang on a tick?  What this about having a record of the transfer to AMC-TENDER?  That wasn't in the original set of instructions.

Investors who fail for any reason to provide the information necessary to obtain "Verified" status on Bitfunder are encouraged to transfer their shares on BitFunder to the Bitfunder user AMC-TENDER no later than November 13, 2013 before dividends are paid.  All Investors transferring their shares to this account will continue to accumulated dividends on their shares. 

Once Bitfunder is back up you can log in and get the record of the tender. If you did not tender or do not have the record, Ukyo is providing all asset issuers with the appropriate records within a few days (hopefully). It was supposed to happen on Dec. 2nd but apparently was delayed.

[SoylentCreek]

Hang on a tick?  What this about having a record of the transfer to AMC-TENDER?  That wasn't in the original set of instructions.

Investors who fail for any reason to provide the information necessary to obtain "Verified" status on Bitfunder are encouraged to transfer their shares on BitFunder to the Bitfunder user AMC-TENDER no later than November 13, 2013 before dividends are paid.  All Investors transferring their shares to this account will continue to accumulated dividends on their shares.  

Once Bitfunder is back up you can log in and get the record of the tender. If you did not tender or do not have the record, Ukyo is providing all asset issuers with the appropriate records within a few days (hopefully). It was supposed to happen on Dec. 2nd but apparently was delayed.

God I hope Ukyo does not fuck this up.

EDIT:  How hard would it have been to have sent a confirmation email to the registered email address at the time of transfer?  Seriously...

[crumbs]

Hang on a tick?  What this about having a record of the transfer to AMC-TENDER?  That wasn't in the original set of instructions.

Investors who fail for any reason to provide the information necessary to obtain "Verified" status on Bitfunder are encouraged to transfer their shares on BitFunder to the Bitfunder user AMC-TENDER no later than November 13, 2013 before dividends are paid.  All Investors transferring their shares to this account will continue to accumulated dividends on their shares.  

Once Bitfunder is back up you can log in and get the record of the tender. If you did not tender or do not have the record, Ukyo is providing all asset issuers with the appropriate records within a few days (hopefully). It was supposed to happen on Dec. 2nd but apparently was delayed.

Though since Kenneth has threatened to sue Ukyo, this curtesy may not be extended
*A fiendishly clever ploy!!1!

[minerpart]

Re-post re: share price-

I'm sure some of you have heard of a thing called P/E ratio (price-earnings ratio)?

It's a very simple formula universally used for valuing a listed company and it's shares which most often involves you dividing the share price by the annualised earnings per share.

here is a basic introduction:

http://www.allstarstocks.com/gpage2.html


So instead of guessing how much you think share price will go to using your divining rod or a set of Rune stones just use the p/e ratio.

All you need to know is the total amount of BTC that will be paid out in divs to public investors in year 1 and then you divide that by the number of shares to get your annual earnings per share figure. You then choose a share price - lets say the IPO of 0.0025 and divide that by your annual earnings per share figure to get the p/e ratio.

An acceptable p/e ratio to investors in the real world would range from anything from 10:1 to 100:1 - it's going to be based around the company prospects for growth and continued business.

OK so who want's to start? Me? OK-

I think 4justice's table gave a yearly total for public investors (taking into account the drop when Kens shares get divs) of around 40k BTC.

40,000/10,000,000=0.004
0.0025/.004=0.625

So now we need to decide what P/E ratio investors will be happy with. 0.625:1 would put the share price at 0.0025 - obviously. Now if the company has solid prospects and good accounts there is a world of investors out there who would bite your right arm off to get in at a P/E ratio of 0.625:1. It's incredibly good value - so long as the company is solid.

I would say with BTC rising so commendably that a P/E ration of 10:1 would be conservative - so that would mean a share price of 0.04 > 0.04/0.004=10

Anyone please correct my arithmetic/logic and make comments.

PPS - 4justice's table is I think conservative.

[lobbes]

Hang on a tick?  What this about having a record of the transfer to AMC-TENDER?  That wasn't in the original set of instructions.

Investors who fail for any reason to provide the information necessary to obtain "Verified" status on Bitfunder are encouraged to transfer their shares on BitFunder to the Bitfunder user AMC-TENDER no later than November 13, 2013 before dividends are paid.  All Investors transferring their shares to this account will continue to accumulated dividends on their shares.  

Once Bitfunder is back up you can log in and get the record of the tender. If you did not tender or do not have the record, Ukyo is providing all asset issuers with the appropriate records within a few days (hopefully). It was supposed to happen on Dec. 2nd but apparently was delayed.

Though since Kenneth has threatened to sue Ukyo, this curtesy may not be extended
*A fiendishly clever ploy!!1!

Well Ken just said that if all else fails, you will be able to use your registered BTC address to authenticate

Yes, if Bitfunder comes back up.  Should anyone not have access to that information, we will use their registered Bitcoin address as a backup.

[bitmoon]

Cool, so anyone who doesn't have a photo can just log in to Bitfunder and take those details from their logs.

Yes, if Bitfunder comes back up.  Should anyone not have access to that information, we will use their registered Bitcoin address as a backup.

i want to understand that bolded sentence,  do you mean you have list of user and associated btc address,

[PurpleTentacle]

Ken, when you say you'll need the date and time of share transfer, do I have to convert it to your time zone? 

[iamnot_]

Cool, so anyone who doesn't have a photo can just log in to Bitfunder and take those details from their logs.

Yes, if Bitfunder comes back up.  Should anyone not have access to that information, we will use their registered Bitcoin address as a backup.

i want to understand that bolded sentence,  do you mean you have list of user and associated btc address,

The public asset list is here: https://bitfunder.com/assetlist.json.

If you can sign from the address listed, you will have no problem claiming the shares. If you can't, you can work with Ukyo using your Bitfunder account login to claim the shares. Either way I don't think there will be any problem.

[Stuartuk]

If it goes to .04 I will sell. that would mean that ActM is worth 1/30th of the total outstanding bitcoins.

That's actually irrelevant to any companies true value which is what informs the share price.

The main point is what will annualised dividend payout be in that scenario. Minerpart's calculations show that each share holder will be getting a 10% payout each year. So for example if you hold 100BTC of ACtM you will make 10BTC each year - that is a tremendous return and is extremely rare for any established and secure company's stock in the real world. That is why experienced investors will be happy to pay that price. This is based on VMC and ACtM becoming regarded as a safe investment. That will be the case when we start taking some serious orders and open the farm.

[SoylentCreek]

Cool, so anyone who doesn't have a photo can just log in to Bitfunder and take those details from their logs.

Yes, if Bitfunder comes back up.  Should anyone not have access to that information, we will use their registered Bitcoin address as a backup.

i want to understand that bolded sentence,  do you mean you have list of user and associated btc address,

I believe when you registered for the Bitfunder account, you were required to set a public withdrawal address.  Now just pray that you remember which address you used, and that you have the ability to sign from it.  

[stenkross]

Re-post re: share price-

I'm sure some of you have heard of a thing called P/E ratio (price-earnings ratio)?

It's a very simple formula universally used for valuing a listed company and it's shares which most often involves you dividing the share price by the annualised earnings per share.

here is a basic introduction:

http://www.allstarstocks.com/gpage2.html


So instead of guessing how much you think share price will go to using your divining rod or a set of Rune stones just use the p/e ratio.

All you need to know is the total amount of BTC that will be paid out in divs to public investors in year 1 and then you divide that by the number of shares to get your annual earnings per share figure. You then choose a share price - lets say the IPO of 0.0025 and divide that by your annual earnings per share figure to get the p/e ratio.

An acceptable p/e ratio to investors in the real world would range from anything from 10:1 to 100:1 - it's going to be based around the company prospects for growth and continued business.

OK so who want's to start? Me? OK-

I think 4justice's table gave a yearly total for public investors (taking into account the drop when Kens shares get divs) of around 40k BTC.

40,000/10,000,000=0.004
0.0025/.004=0.625

So now we need to decide what P/E ratio investors will be happy with. 0.625:1 would put the share price at 0.0025 - obviously. Now if the company has solid prospects and good accounts there is a world of investors out there who would bite your right arm off to get in at a P/E ratio of 0.625:1. It's incredibly good value - so long as the company is solid.

I would say with BTC rising so commendably that a P/E ration of 10:1 would be conservative - so that would mean a share price of 0.04 > 0.04/0.004=10

Anyone please correct my arithmetic/logic and make comments.

PPS - 4justice's table is I think conservative.

40k BTC / year in dividend = 80k BTC in profit, since 50% is re-invested.
80k BTC in profit = 6% of network hashing power, or less if you can get profit from sales, but somewhere 4-5% is needed I'd guess.
On average over a whole year.

That's pretty optimistic don't you think?

I'm happy if ActM can reach 1% of total hashing power (~1/5 of what you assume).

[bobboooiie]

The whole picture and details thing is a bit silly IMO, you should just go with some automated address signing and save yourself a lot of time KEN.

[VolanicEruptor]

Cool, so anyone who doesn't have a photo can just log in to Bitfunder and take those details from their logs.

Yes, if Bitfunder comes back up.  Should anyone not have access to that information, we will use their registered Bitcoin address as a backup.

i want to understand that bolded sentence,  do you mean you have list of user and associated btc address,

The public asset list is here: https://bitfunder.com/assetlist.json.

If you can sign from the address listed, you will have no problem claiming the shares. If you can't, you can work with Ukyo using your Bitfunder account login to claim the shares. Either way I don't think there will be any problem.

There's a huge problem with that list.. all of the shares are tendered to the address of AMC-TENDER, so therefore do not show up.  This is what I was trying to warn everybody about

I meant most of the shares.  Look at the address that holds 8.5 million shares.  That's where most of us are..

[bitmoon]

Cool, so anyone who doesn't have a photo can just log in to Bitfunder and take those details from their logs.

Yes, if Bitfunder comes back up.  Should anyone not have access to that information, we will use their registered Bitcoin address as a backup.

i want to understand that bolded sentence,  do you mean you have list of user and associated btc address,

I believe when you registered for the Bitfunder account, you were required to set a public withdrawal address.  Now just pray that you remember which address you used, and that you have the ability to sign from it.  

just wanted to understand if there are other lists other than logs and public asset list.

now what happens if user signs with different address?

[SoylentCreek]

Cool, so anyone who doesn't have a photo can just log in to Bitfunder and take those details from their logs.

Yes, if Bitfunder comes back up.  Should anyone not have access to that information, we will use their registered Bitcoin address as a backup.

i want to understand that bolded sentence,  do you mean you have list of user and associated btc address,

The public asset list is here: https://bitfunder.com/assetlist.json.

If you can sign from the address listed, you will have no problem claiming the shares. If you can't, you can work with Ukyo using your Bitfunder account login to claim the shares. Either way I don't think there will be any problem.

There's a huge problem with that list.. all of the shares are tendered to the address of AMC-TENDER, so therefore do not show up.  This is what I was trying to warn everybody about

I meant most of the shares.  Look at the address that holds 8.5 million shares.  That's where most of us are..

Hence why my address is no where on that list.  

[PurpleTentacle]

Cool, so anyone who doesn't have a photo can just log in to Bitfunder and take those details from their logs.

Yes, if Bitfunder comes back up.  Should anyone not have access to that information, we will use their registered Bitcoin address as a backup.

i want to understand that bolded sentence,  do you mean you have list of user and associated btc address,

The public asset list is here: https://bitfunder.com/assetlist.json.

If you can sign from the address listed, you will have no problem claiming the shares. If you can't, you can work with Ukyo using your Bitfunder account login to claim the shares. Either way I don't think there will be any problem.

There's a huge problem with that list.. all of the shares are tendered to the address of AMC-TENDER, so therefore do not show up.  This is what I was trying to warn everybody about

I meant most of the shares.  Look at the address that holds 8.5 million shares.  That's where most of us are..

Hence why my address is no where on that list.  

Ken said that he has multiple backups of that list.