[ANN] profit switching auto-exchanging pool - www.middlecoin.com

[BombaUcigasa]

I find this interesting, I had just assumed that 280x was best due to everyone saying it was next best to 7950s.  Obviously this doesn't consider power consumption, but i believe the 270x are pretty light on power anyway.  But obviously you would need a lot more cards to make up the same hashing so maybe power consumption is a big factor.

You fill your mobo on all 6 slots with 270x. Then what? You need to purchase another rig for the other boards. Some people have bigger budgets.

Also, your 7x290x setup needs more PSUs...

[EdBoon]

I find this interesting, I had just assumed that 280x was best due to everyone saying it was next best to 7950s.  Obviously this doesn't consider power consumption, but i believe the 270x are pretty light on power anyway.  But obviously you would need a lot more cards to make up the same hashing so maybe power consumption is a big factor.

You fill your mobo on all 6 slots with 270x. Then what? You need to purchase another rig for the other boards. Some people have bigger budgets.

Also, your 7x290x setup needs more PSUs...

the mobo i have on the 7x rigs have 7 slots and 2 PSUs factored in with enough juice for 7 gpus

[gtraah]

I just checked the graphs and there is a MASSIVE Dip in hashpower, almost asif it dropped down to half my hash rate power for an hour or 2?

Whats going on? Half way into Monday now I thought there was going to be a fix in the D/C. Seems to still be happening

I also hear my rig drop in FAN- RPM and rise again Numerous times - This is telling me that temperatures drop below the AutoFan setting of 70c which again means my Rig is not in full use. Mot likely because of D/C & re-connects and various other things

[jedimstr]

I just checked the graphs and there is a MASSIVE Dip in hashpower, almost asif it dropped down to half my hash rate power for an hour or 2?

Whats going on? Half way into Monday now I thought there was going to be a fix in the D/C. Seems to still be happening

I also hear my rig drop in FAN- RPM and rise again Numerous times - This is telling me that temperatures drop below the AutoFan setting of 70c which again means my Rig is not in full use. Mot likely because of D/C & re-connects and various other things

It's still Sunday evening in the USA.  H2O is based in the middle of the United States... so... he's fixing it tomorrow your time, but still meets his schedule since he was basing it on his timezone.

[sykal]

that's some sick hash right there.
That would be about 26 mining rigs with 4 R9-270x cards in each. (about 25k worth of hardware)

Do you have a secret to building cheap rigs? I'm not being sarcastic, just really wondering how it is possible to build a 4x270x for under a grand.  by my calculations:

4x270x Rig   
ram   $25.00
processor   $42.00
mobo   $60.00
psu   $210.00
hd/memory stick   $20.00
# of gpus   4
gpus total cost   $800.00
hardware (rig/case)   $30.00
adapters   $30.00
   
   
Total   $1,217.00
$/KH   $0.68

Always interested in info regarding cutting down costs on rig building.

Considering 3x290x rig in comparison:
3x290x Rig   
ram   $25.00
processor   $42.00
mobo   $60.00
psu   $210.00
hd/memory stick   $20.00
# of gpus   3
gpus total cost   $1,887.00
hardware (rig/case)   $30.00
adapters   $30.00
   
   
Total   $2,304.00
total KH   $2700
$/KH   $0.85

so actually seems to be cheaper builds on the 270s, obviously costs would go down with more cards, if u compare 7 cards u get:
7x270x = $0.61/KH
7x280x = $0.66/KH
7x7950 = $0.76/KH
7x290x = $0.80/KH

I find this interesting, I had just assumed that 280x was best due to everyone saying it was next best to 7950s.  Obviously this doesn't consider power consumption, but i believe the 270x are pretty light on power anyway.  But obviously you would need a lot more cards to make up the same hashing so maybe power consumption is a big factor.

270 is one of the best for the $. They use little power, and they run very cool.

For the cost, you can substitute a $4 milk crate instead of a case, a PSU like the seasonic 860 goes for $185, and you can even find 270's for $180.

[jedimstr]

that's some sick hash right there.
That would be about 26 mining rigs with 4 R9-270x cards in each. (about 25k worth of hardware)

Do you have a secret to building cheap rigs? I'm not being sarcastic, just really wondering how it is possible to build a 4x270x for under a grand.  by my calculations:

4x270x Rig   
ram   $25.00
processor   $42.00
mobo   $60.00
psu   $210.00
hd/memory stick   $20.00
# of gpus   4
gpus total cost   $800.00
hardware (rig/case)   $30.00
adapters   $30.00
   
   
Total   $1,217.00
$/KH   $0.68

Always interested in info regarding cutting down costs on rig building.

Considering 3x290x rig in comparison:
3x290x Rig   
ram   $25.00
processor   $42.00
mobo   $60.00
psu   $210.00
hd/memory stick   $20.00
# of gpus   3
gpus total cost   $1,887.00
hardware (rig/case)   $30.00
adapters   $30.00
   
   
Total   $2,304.00
total KH   $2700
$/KH   $0.85

so actually seems to be cheaper builds on the 270s, obviously costs would go down with more cards, if u compare 7 cards u get:
7x270x = $0.61/KH
7x280x = $0.66/KH
7x7950 = $0.76/KH
7x290x = $0.80/KH

I find this interesting, I had just assumed that 280x was best due to everyone saying it was next best to 7950s.  Obviously this doesn't consider power consumption, but i believe the 270x are pretty light on power anyway.  But obviously you would need a lot more cards to make up the same hashing so maybe power consumption is a big factor.

270 is one of the best for the $. They use little power, and they run very cool.

For the cost, you can substitute a $4 milk crate instead of a case, a PSU like the seasonic 860 goes for $185, and you can even find 270's for $180.

270 is potentially best when not factoring in power consumption at similar hashrates for the total rig.  In that case, when power use/cost is a consideration, 7950 is still king and 280x comes a close second.  So if you've got free power, but don't have the capital to go whole hog with a set of 290's, go for the 270.... but if you're paying for the sparky sparky stuff, then you're better off finding used 7950 or new 280x.

[gtraah]

I just checked the graphs and there is a MASSIVE Dip in hashpower, almost asif it dropped down to half my hash rate power for an hour or 2?

Whats going on? Half way into Monday now I thought there was going to be a fix in the D/C. Seems to still be happening

I also hear my rig drop in FAN- RPM and rise again Numerous times - This is telling me that temperatures drop below the AutoFan setting of 70c which again means my Rig is not in full use. Mot likely because of D/C & re-connects and various other things

It's still Sunday evening in the USA.  H2O is based in the middle of the United States... so... he's fixing it tomorrow your time, but still meets his schedule since he was basing it on his timezone.

Ahh I see, Thanks for that I was wondering if this was the case.

[sykal]

that's some sick hash right there.
That would be about 26 mining rigs with 4 R9-270x cards in each. (about 25k worth of hardware)

Do you have a secret to building cheap rigs? I'm not being sarcastic, just really wondering how it is possible to build a 4x270x for under a grand.  by my calculations:

4x270x Rig   
ram   $25.00
processor   $42.00
mobo   $60.00
psu   $210.00
hd/memory stick   $20.00
# of gpus   4
gpus total cost   $800.00
hardware (rig/case)   $30.00
adapters   $30.00
   
   
Total   $1,217.00
$/KH   $0.68

Always interested in info regarding cutting down costs on rig building.

Considering 3x290x rig in comparison:
3x290x Rig   
ram   $25.00
processor   $42.00
mobo   $60.00
psu   $210.00
hd/memory stick   $20.00
# of gpus   3
gpus total cost   $1,887.00
hardware (rig/case)   $30.00
adapters   $30.00
   
   
Total   $2,304.00
total KH   $2700
$/KH   $0.85

so actually seems to be cheaper builds on the 270s, obviously costs would go down with more cards, if u compare 7 cards u get:
7x270x = $0.61/KH
7x280x = $0.66/KH
7x7950 = $0.76/KH
7x290x = $0.80/KH

I find this interesting, I had just assumed that 280x was best due to everyone saying it was next best to 7950s.  Obviously this doesn't consider power consumption, but i believe the 270x are pretty light on power anyway.  But obviously you would need a lot more cards to make up the same hashing so maybe power consumption is a big factor.

270 is one of the best for the $. They use little power, and they run very cool.

For the cost, you can substitute a $4 milk crate instead of a case, a PSU like the seasonic 860 goes for $185, and you can even find 270's for $180.

270 is potentially best when not factoring in power consumption at similar hashrates for the total rig.  In that case, when power use/cost is a consideration, 7950 is still king and 280x comes a close second.  So if you've got free power, but don't have the capital to go whole hog with a set of 290's, go for the 270.... but if you're paying for the sparky sparky stuff, then you're better off finding used 7950 or new 280x.

How is the 7950 and 280x king when the 270 uses less power?

[EdBoon]

How is the 7950 and 280x king when the 270 uses less power?

I think he is referring to KH per Watt

[mikeybit]

Is anyone else getting a whole lot of work restarts?  My hashrate dropped like a rock and I'm getting a whole lot of work restarts in cgminer.

[CrimsonPermanentAssurance]

Could be just you. I have been going strong with 8MH/s on US server all night and day with typical numbers for rejects at about 2%.

[jedimstr]

How is the 7950 and 280x king when the 270 uses less power?

I think he is referring to KH per Watt

Yup... there are plenty of cards out there and integrated Intel GPUs that use less power... but aren't worth crap for their hashrate.

So the 7950 is still king when it comes to KH/s at its power consumption rate.  Especially when you use one of Lantis' scrypt bin files for cgminer and if you undervolt with the .967v firmware.

[LPCobris]

^I honestly have no idea how it works. I've been in queue for what seems like forever.

Hi!
Thanks for the explanation...
But what that really means in pratic terms? The Light Blue bar is what i will still recieve? What am i really getting payout?
The green light bar is imature coin? What is that? Some coin i just mined but its still too low valued?

Sorry but its my first time with so much data to analyse and correlate!

Thanks!

LPC

What is the unexchanged balance?

This is your balance of coins other than bitcoins. My auto-exchanger will convert them into bitcoins, usually within a day. Some coins take a while to reach "trade maturity" to where you can send them without paying a fee. These coins will take longer to be converted into bitcoins.

What is the immature unexchanged balance?

This is your balance obtained from blocks that have not yet reached maturity, and are therefore possible orphans. After a designated number of blocks, you will be credited these coins, and they will go under your "unexchanged balance" column. Some coins take longer than others to mature. For example, NovaCoin takes three days.

from http://middlecoin2.s3-website-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/faq.html

You'll more-or-less receive the unexchanged & immature amount, though since they aren't cashed out, it's possible it'll change a bit. In my experience, they've never deviated much from what's stated. (which is a bit suspicious since we're all in tin-foil mode )

Thanks!
Hummm...
Let me see if i understand...

The green bar are the possibile mined coins that still need to be verified by the network? When they are validated they go to the blue bar?
In the blue bar what happens? They wait until they are selled and converted to btc? how this correlates to the payout in the red line?

From what i understand the red bar is a reflex of yesterday blue bar? Its correct?

Best Regards,

LPC

You have it right.

The workflow looks like:
Coins mined -> (green) Coins "age" to ensure they're considered valid by the network and so transaction fees are minimal -> (blue) Coins sit in h2o-controlled wallets waiting for an opportunity to sell at a "good" price (as determined by h2o) -> (red) When there's a "good" sell opportunity, the altcoins are sold for bitcoins and is converted to "balance" which is paid at the next payout time.

With some coins, there is no need for them to age and coins are immediately converted to BTC and credited as a balance, but it changes based on which coins are being mined and the particular exchange h2o is using.

I seee!

Thanks for the explanation, im really clarified now!
So what is the information that i need to keep paying attention? the blue bar?

Best Regards,

LPC

Hi
Can anyone reply on this matter?

BTW, i notice som lower numbers on the light blue bar... and the pay line seems to be lowering... Does anyone knows why?
Im on the US server...

Thanks,

LPC

[locksmith9]

Just as a datapoint for new(er)-comers to this pool like myself: my earnings are approximately 19% higher over the last 6 days through middlecoin than they would have mining with wemineltc.

My calculations are based on:

• the current LTC difficulty of 3366.694 (I realize the difficulty has increased)
• a 2% reject rate at wemineltc (and I average 4-5% rejects with middlecoin since the server update)
• 1% pool fee to wemineltc
• a 0.2% trading fee at btc-e

Higher earnings and less hassle trading LTC->BTC. I'm pretty satisfied with middlecoin thus far, especially after the server fixes this weekend.

[gtraah]

• (and I average 4-5% rejects with middlecoin since the server update)

What Server Update? I was just told it has not happened yet? I am on the US server and a few hours ago I had massive Hash reduction and D/c's

Although the past 45 min I have been hearing my rig go Full blast , Full Hash, Full speed.

Not sure if he implemented the fix within the last 45 min or not :\

[kalus]

wow, H2o did it. 



we're on the moon now.

[drakoin]

So what is the information that i need to keep paying attention? the blue bar?

Can anyone reply on this matter?

I guess no one has replied yet because your questions were already answered fully. Read the answers again :-)


You want to learn more how to understand and compare profitability, right?

Perhaps it helps you if I share what I did because I needed to know exactly ... and for my first weeks of mining, I have had a very close look at sometimes less-than-one-day phases, because I was switching pools fast, was disappointed by some pools, left because of chaos, tweaked GPU cards, switched off computers, forgot to put --scrypt :-) etc.

Now I am in calmer waters, and know more what I do, and essentially just observe what drops into my wallet  - but that is the result of active learning, and most of it all, book keeping.


I created an Excel file with the following columns:

Code:

datetime | datetime diff | khash av 

the datetime diff is e.g. b7 = a7-a6 and gives the exact length of the timespan

more columns:

Code:

Immature Unexchanged Balance | Unexchanged Balance | Balance | Paid Out | total sum middlecoin

the total sum mc is e.g. g7 = sum(d7:g7)

Similiar for a doge-pool which is my failover when middlecoin is ill

Code:

confirmed	| unconfirmed | total sum dogecoins

Then I have two more columns

Code:

doge/eur | btc/eur

with current exchange rates which I look up at
http://preev.com/ and
http://www.cryptocoincharts.info/#jump-doge-btc

and then of course, and very very important, measured with a 8 euro powermeter:

Code:

kWh | kWh in Euros | kWh-euro-diff

From all that I can then calculate

Code:

total doges in euros | total earnings in euro | earnings since last time

subtract the electricity and get:

Code:

profit since last time

and as I want to see how it scales:

Code:

average profit estimated per day per megahash

done.

I see how much it is fluctuating. Not so much actually.
Around Xmas it was gruesome, but fortunately I kept my coins in BTC, and now ... the past looks better :-)

With each new pool/coin I try out I need to insert new columns, yeah bad, but not too bad


And all that goes into ONE LINE in Excel, because then the next line is just filling in the values, pulling a few calculation cells down - and the result is there.


Does this help?
Overanswered, I guess :-)

[LPCobris]

wow, H2o did it. 



we're on the moon now.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

Middlecoin going on the moon!



LPC

[coin123123]

I've been watching us server for a while and seems it switches between doge ltc ftc wdc, according to coinwars minetips and coinchoose there is no logic to this cause ltc is never more profitable than others, ftc even less profitable than ltc, and beside those there are about 15 other coins which are more profitable.

also it switches about every minute which is waste because profitability not changing that frequently.

meanwhile most my power back to multipool because their switching algorithm is more profitable but I hope to be back if it fixed.

[LPCobris]

So what is the information that i need to keep paying attention? the blue bar?

Can anyone reply on this matter?

I guess no one has replied yet because your questions were already answered fully. Read the answers again :-)


You want to learn more how to understand and compare profitability, right?

Perhaps it helps you if I share what I did because I needed to know exactly ... and for my first weeks of mining, I have had a very close look at sometimes less-than-one-day phases, because I was switching pools fast, was disappointed by some pools, left because of chaos, tweaked GPU cards, switched off computers, forgot to put --scrypt :-) etc.

Now I am in calmer waters, and know more what I do, and essentially just observe what drops into my wallet  - but that is the result of active learning, and most of it all, book keeping.


I created an Excel file with the following columns:

Code:

datetime | datetime diff | khash av 

the datetime diff is e.g. b7 = a7-a6 and gives the exact length of the timespan

more columns:

Code:

Immature Unexchanged Balance | Unexchanged Balance | Balance | Paid Out | total sum middlecoin

the total sum mc is e.g. g7 = sum(d7:g7)

Similiar for a doge-pool which is my failover when middlecoin is ill

Code:

confirmed	| unconfirmed | total sum dogecoins

Then I have two more columns

Code:

doge/eur | btc/eur

with current exchange rates which I look up at
http://preev.com/ and
http://www.cryptocoincharts.info/#jump-doge-btc

and then of course, and very very important, measured with a 8 euro powermeter:

Code:

kWh | kWh in Euros | kWh-euro-diff

From all that I can then calculate

Code:

total doges in euros | total earnings in euro | earnings since last time

subtract the electricity and get:

Code:

profit since last time

and as I want to see how it scales:

Code:

average profit estimated per day per megahash

done.

I see how much it is fluctuating. Not so much actually.
Around Xmas it was gruesome, but fortunately I kept my coins in BTC, and now ... the past looks better :-)

With each new pool/coin I try out I need to insert new columns, yeah bad, but not too bad


And all that goes into ONE LINE in Excel, because then the next line is just filling in the values, pulling a few calculation cells down - and the result is there.


Does this help?
Overanswered, I guess :-)

Whoa Drakoin!
That is deep!

Can you send me the file you made to see if i can make some order out of all this information stream?
I can give you my email via PM if you wish...

I don´t really know an awfull a lot, but im learning (or at least trying!)...

Thanks in avance for the attention...

Best Regards,

LPC