Black Arrow 28nm 100Ghash Bitcoin ASIC from $0.49/GH/s

[jochemin]

I had my refund this week. They sent me a mail, I have had to sign the bitcoin address y paid from saying that after the refund I have nothing to claim from BA nor them from me.

In the mail also they say that they have had problems changing dollars to bitcoin and they only refund the bitcoins I paid minus $50 fee. So I received 9,0.... bitcoin.

In the mail says that If you don't accept this conditions, the order will go on.

I accepted it, I lost more than $2000 in this, but it's better than wait for a unprofitable machine.

[freddyfarnsworth]

I had my refund this week. They sent me a mail, I have had to sign the bitcoin address y paid from saying that after the refund I have nothing to claim from BA nor them from me.

In the mail also they say that they have had problems changing dollars to bitcoin and they only refund the bitcoins I paid minus $50 fee. So I received 9,0.... bitcoin.

In the mail says that If you don't accept this conditions, the order will go on.

I accepted it, I lost more than $2000 in this, but it's better than wait for a unprofitable machine.

Bitcoins will go up, the miner never will. The miners will get cheaper when all is done. I think you did right.

[mtbitcoin]

I had my refund this week. They sent me a mail, I have had to sign the bitcoin address y paid from saying that after the refund I have nothing to claim from BA nor them from me.

In the mail also they say that they have had problems changing dollars to bitcoin and they only refund the bitcoins I paid minus $50 fee. So I received 9,0.... bitcoin.

In the mail says that If you don't accept this conditions, the order will go on.

I accepted it, I lost more than $2000 in this, but it's better than wait for a unprofitable machine.

Sigh... so let me get this straight, they refund you lesser amounts of bitcoin than what you paid for (in USD). I wonder if the tables were turned around and the BTC price was higher, would they still be refunding you the same amount of in BTC   

[jochemin]

I had my refund this week. They sent me a mail, I have had to sign the bitcoin address y paid from saying that after the refund I have nothing to claim from BA nor them from me.

In the mail also they say that they have had problems changing dollars to bitcoin and they only refund the bitcoins I paid minus $50 fee. So I received 9,0.... bitcoin.

In the mail says that If you don't accept this conditions, the order will go on.

I accepted it, I lost more than $2000 in this, but it's better than wait for a unprofitable machine.

Sigh... so let me get this straight, they refund you lesser amounts of bitcoin than what you paid for (in USD). I wonder if the tables were turned around and the BTC price was higher, would they still be refunding you the same amount of in BTC  

We all know the answer to that question.

[shogunmark]

Being a BA customer is like renting the downstairs apartment in an outhouse.

^This

With the broken promises and delays, this sums up exactly how i feel. I am finally at the point where i am one more delay away from pulling out completely. Granted i am only in for 2 X-1's, but we are almost halfway through april and BA don't even have a working prototype... Come on BA, this is getting ridiculous.

[necro_nemesis]

Bitcoin Miners progress update – 10 April 2014
1. Minion
Received news from Global Foundries: they are 8 days ahead of schedule and will ship the wafers next week
Have discussed and received great support from our packaging company, we’re looking forward to receive the chip.

It would appear they are waiting for wafers this week and they require packaging into chips.

[coolmusic]

Why BA must convert the payments received in btc to fiat currency ?

 In the moment they make the exchange start to generate taxes and financial expenses.

Is much better hold it as long as you can specially if at least part of your suppliers also accept payments from you in Btc

I guess If the Btc remains in the zone of 1000$ we don't have this conversation.

[Flying Hellfish]

So less than 3 weeks till delivery is supposed to start?  No chips in hand yet and no working proto??

Me thinks the delay train is about to run over some more investomers 

[raskul]

So less than 3 weeks till delivery is supposed to start?  No chips in hand yet and no working proto??

Me thinks the delay train is about to run over some more investomers 

Yeah we have started to really notice, there was more faith a couple weeks ago but now the question is how are they going to compensate for
1:Not making their second delay when they were supposed to be shipped in Feb.
2: Not being able to compete with rival companies now for price and ghash.

It's beginning to look like deliberate deceit, like they never had any intention of honouring their delivery schedule.

They are so far off the pace it could be next year before some folks get their hardware.

 

meanwhile...

https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/difficulty

[tempestb]

I will hold off on judging until they tell us what the state of the chips are.  If they've come back, work as expected, and they don't have to make any major changes to anything, it's quite possible they can deliver on time.  But like everyone has been saying, the stars need to align for it to go off without a hitch.

[newguy05]

just doing currency pair arbitrage with your money, make a directional bet after getting the funds, if btc/usd move in the right direction, they make a lot of money, if the pair moves in the wrong direction, you take the hit - refund btc if btc goes down, refund usd if btc goes up.  They have no risk.

i also got a bridge in my backyard for sale if you guys still think they can make some useful hardware.

[Noruka]

Why BA must convert the payments received in btc to fiat currency ?

 In the moment they make the exchange start to generate taxes and financial expenses.

Is much better hold it as long as you can specially if at least part of your suppliers also accept payments from you in Btc

I guess If the Btc remains in the zone of 1000$ we don't have this conversation.

because when they got the BTC they probably liquidated it to fiat for business expenses. Since BTC is half its high they get to steal half your store of value.

[bobsag3]

Imported orders should now show, but we are not 100% done yet, so please be patient if something is missing/ wrong.

Some international orders may not appear due to invalid country codes and will be added manually.

Orders may appear as fulfilled even though they have not shipped.

http://minersource.net/blogs/news/13686173-imported-orders

[TinkerTom]

Update of my refund:

I received a check yesterday from Minersource in the agreed upon amount and brought it to the bank today.  The teller cashed the check and gave me some cash and put the rest into my account, so I do not think their was any problem with the check.

I appreciate the refund guys, keep up the good work.  For those of you still waiting on refunds I wish you the best.  I will be one of you again if the price keeps going up and I need to unload my bunch of X-1's.

Thanks,

DebitMe

Well that's good to hear, but I've had no luck. After 2 weeks of emails, PMs and phone calls, I finally got a reply from Matt yesterday after I set an appointment to meet him at their offices on Wednesday. (I live about 20 minutes away.) It turns out the location listed on Minersource.net is a mail drop. Matt didn't offer the physical address, but gave a curt reply that due to the size of my refund (4 X-3s) he had to get it OKd by BA.

It's BS that it took me stating that I was coming to the office for him to finally reply, and it's also bs to push responsibility off on BA. I purchased the miners from Minersource.net, not from BA. Minersource owes me the refund. I've been trying to keep this civil and out of the public forums, but all I get in return is silence and then that bullshit. It is hard not to think I'm being ignored with the hope that the machines will ship and they won't have to pay out.

I had even offered to help migrate their old database, to which he replied in this forum that he had PMd me, but he never did. I even reached out to him via email to help on that, but never heard back.

DebitMe, would you mind sharing how many machines your refund was for?

[cdog]

Dear Customers,

We just want to let you know that we have not forgotten our promise and we will match in Ghash any competitor at the time of shipping. There is no point in discussing yet what extra hashing power you will receive as we have not started shipping yet.

ASIC price match announced in this thread is part of our promise.

Regards!

I would be impressed if we get a competitive per $ gh at ship time, it would actually almost make up for these insane delays. Sounds promising, but right now I cant say I believe it.

[ChuckBuck]

I wonder if we will get an update today or tomorrow. =/ were getting down to the wire.

Need my weekly progress update fix.  Don't care that it's delayed(I do) just need me some pics and renders!

Could there be a working prototype in Black Arrow's future?   

[sorehammer]

Imported orders should now show, but we are not 100% done yet, so please be patient if something is missing/ wrong.

Some international orders may not appear due to invalid country codes and will be added manually.

Orders may appear as fulfilled even though they have not shipped.

http://minersource.net/blogs/news/13686173-imported-orders

Mine is showing now, but still says partial payment hopefully i will get mine lol

[sorehammer]

Imported orders should now show, but we are not 100% done yet, so please be patient if something is missing/ wrong.

Some international orders may not appear due to invalid country codes and will be added manually.

Orders may appear as fulfilled even though they have not shipped.

http://minersource.net/blogs/news/13686173-imported-orders

Mine is showing now, but still says partial payment hopefully i will get mine lol

Hopefully we all get ours lol!

Fingers and legs crossed

[ChuckBuck]

My order is imported over as well. Hopefully we hear the latest from BA today or tomorrow.

[TinkerTom]

...

...

My refund was for a single X-3, and my heart goes out to you, please know that as this is a very unfortunate circumstance.  I know that is a lot of money that you put out for those, and to have to go through all of that, when more than 20K was on the table is troublesome to say the least.  I wish their was more that I could do, unfortunately I am just a bystander in this, same as you, who apparently got lucky.

Please know I will be praying for you, as well as anyone else who is looking for a way out of this mess.  It pains me to see others get screwed as much as they have.  I am not even blaming MinerSource, as I do not believe this is their fault.  I have ordered with them before and will order with them again.  I have nothing but pleasant experiences working with them, but unfortunately, I think they are getting screwed just as much as everyone else by dealing with BA.  I truly do not believe that BA has malicious intent at heart.  But as we are talking a ton of money, and I assume they had to pay BA to get your order in, we must assume it is BA that is holding this whole thing up.  Not to mention that not a single person who ordered straight from BA has gotten a refund.

So please, I know it is tough not to blame MinerSource, especially with so much money tied into it.  And yes, the laws in the United States protect people from this very thing and you could easily take this to the justice system for resolution, but remember who has really screwed you over here!  MinerSource did not lie about where the production status was back in January, MinerSource has not kept an interest free loan, and gambled on the price of bitcoin with your money, and MinerSource did not use your money to fund development of other projects (scrypt chip).  I agree it was not professional making you wait that long without an explanation, and I assume they take responsibility for doing that, but I think they are under a lot of pressure right now from BA as well.

I will take this opportunity again to explain my feelings about refunds.  GET THEM NOW!  In another day or two when we find out that the devices will take anywhere from a few more days to a few more weeks because something is wrong with the chips, or they cannot manufacture that many devices so quickly, there will be a flood of refund requests, and you will more than likely not get served.  I highly doubt they will be the first company in bitcoinland to provide a chip out of fab that exactly meets their specifications.  In the event that they do end up shipping on time and get orders out, you will still be happy you received a refund, as they will immediately drop the price of their machines and you can buy back again, as they are still selling miners that will presumably ship on the same date as everyone else's orders.  The price drop will far outway the measly 25% compensation package they are currently providing, putting you in a better position.  1 TH/s machines are approaching the $2500 mark (I think I saw someone selling for $2800 ish I think) which is under their current price point.  GET A REFUND NOW OR LOSE OUT, that is my piece of advice.

Thanks for the info and your well wishes. Since I posted I've been in touch with Matt through several emails and I think we will work out something this week. I do agree that he's on the up-and-up and doing the best he can. My real concern was the silence, and now we seem to be making progress.

I also think BA is for real, if you compare this thread to AMT's it's like night and day. I almost ordered from them, but switched and am glad on a daily basis. AMT finally started shipping some miners, but they are horribly broken. I think once the BA machines do deliver they will be quality machines at least. Maybe I'm the eternal optimist though.